Comic Book Resources

I am trying to imagine how Marvel could work in this way. It's not easy. I mean, I think a large part the appeal of a comic series is in it's regularity. Like a TV show- the regularity works to its benefit gaining readers. That's why they don't just do tv movies every few months. But then again, TV shows are usually very careful to give SOME sort of FULL story in an episode, even if it's part of a long story.

It would only work, I think, with certain things. For example, I think the Warren Ellis Iron Man would have benefitted from being released as a trade. It kept getting later and later, and sales just kept dropping. Same with lots of the big headline series. But what keeps interest alive if there is no comics for six months?

I think the solution would be to only do this for some series. Maybe have the Whedon/Cassaday X-Men book come out in trades, but release the others monthly. Plus, there ARE still books Marvel publishes that work well as issues: Cable & Deadpool, She-Hulk, Marvel Team-Up, FNH Spider-Man(when not a crossover)... I'm sure some more I can't think of off hand.

I actually don't think I would want ALL Marvel books (or DC books... or Image books) to move to trade format. Some of them still do a damned good job on issues.

I gave up the monthly habit several years ago. I've been buying exclusively trades for the past few years and apart from lagging behind on storylines I don't really regret it at all. I can understand the complaints I see about decompressed storytelling (it may have been that peculiar period of Cerebus when Sim started taking entire issues just to walk down a hallway that started my slow conversion away from the monthlies), but I don't ever experience it. To me someone like Bendis comes across as nuanced with a great ear for conversation. If I were reading it monthly I'm sure I'd despise the man.

I rise up, brother, and stand with you! Throw off the monthly yoke!

I don't know if I agree with that, although I normally do agree with your columns. I really enjoy reading a couple of titles regularly- I like being able to look forward to a regular dosage of Nextwave and All-Star Superman (even if that one's not all that regular), for instance. And like you said, sales figures and historical trends tell us that most comics fans prefer it that way as well. We can't just say "you don't like that format anymore, you like this one" and expect them to hop to it.

Unless I understand your argument wrong, then this plan wouldn't solve what you (and I) consider to be one of the worst parts of the on-going format: even trade paperbacks don't always tell complete stories anymore. This problem wouldn't go away if we just started releasing something similar to trade paperbacks exclusively.

And besides, you just know that even with a book-length format, Bendis and co. would find a way to decompress the hell out of it. We'd be getting book-length tales of Peter Parker walking to the grocery store, and we wouldn't get to see what was on his shopping list until the next book, six months later.

Well, I thought I'd made it clear, but to amplify the idea: You publish stories as self-contained units. As BOOKS. Maybe one's 80 pages, maybe one's two hundred. You rotate creators so there's still a Superman book out once a month or every six weeks or whatever. You just get rid of the serialization. That's my idea. Maybe do gimmick projects like 52 where serialization is part of the fun, but notice that it's not infinite, it's a 52-part story and we all know that going in.

I think it's the current half-breed form of open-ended monthly ongoing serialization, which we used to have, coupled with the expectation of a novel-length story with tight continuity from beginning to end that is the cause of the problem. Marvel and DC aren't doing serialized single issues any more. They're doing 22-page chapters of long novels. I'm saying if you want novels, then damn it, HAVE novels. Publish them AS novels. Go all the way.

"Well, I thought I’d made it clear, but to amplify the idea: You publish stories as self-contained units. As BOOKS."
Well, that wasn't condescending at all. What I'm saying is that even if they did that, and we followed the model of tie-in licensed stuff like you suggested, I maintain that the natural buying habits of the fans that you described and the 'shared universe' nature of the books would gradually ensure that we end up with 80+ page stories that don't move the story along much more than a couple of monthly comics at best.
I guess I'm saying that the theory you're proposing, and the way it would turn out in practice, are two very different things, in my opinion.

I just finished writing a long reply to this article and firefox crashed before I could submit...must be trying to tell me to keep it short. Here's the gist of it:

I myself have often come down with a case of completistism but it's a damn hard habit to shake. I was born in '82 so the buy-it-all mentality has been with me for most of my 16-17 comic reading life. It's interesting to see the perspective of someone who experienced the crossover as it was happening.

I was thinking along the same lines the other day that older crossovers like Secret War and Infinity Gauntlet didn't have as many tie-in titles as stuff today does (someone I'm sure will correct me). So you could have regular monthly titles but when you want to do something Cosmic or have a Crisis then do it all at once in a longer format and just hype the hell out of it.

And that's part of the reason I think publishers are scared to do it - they don't think the fans will be interested if things come out irregularly (despite the success of the Ultimates and Astonishing X-men) . However I really think it could work to their benefit if, like Greg says, you get some Spider-man one month and not again for 6-9 months, then publishers can tap into the addictive nature of comic fans. If the months between Spider-man books has something like a Dr. Strange book and that's the only thing out, then that fan may just try it out to get his comic book "fix," thus increasing readership.

Another thing is that publishers would just have to market the hell out of stuff to make sure people know when its coming out. The increased anticipation that would result from waiting 6 months to read Batman would also work in their favour.

To address the problem of decompressed storytelling: I think it would be much easier for a fan to drop a 200 page book costing $20+ where nothing happens than it is to drop a 23 pager for $3 where nothing happens. The mentality would be “Ok this issue wasn’t very good but it was only $3 and I expect the next one to be better.” If I paid $20+ for something where nothing happened I’d be pissed and sure as hell wouldn’t pick up the next instalment. Furthermore, decompressing say 2 standard issues into the longer format would make for incredibly boring reading and people wouldn’t buy it. As well non-serializing the book format would help in this. If it read like a standard novel where all the plotlines are taken care of by the end, it works.

A friend of mine made a comment on my blog recently about how he doesn’t read comics because they are too short and that he wants something he could really sink his teeth into. This new format could appeal to many folk that feel the same way.

Reply is still long, sorry!

Excellent post as always Greg.

Another possible distribution model is that used in Japan: "Manga magazines usually have many series running concurrently with approximately 20–40 pages allocated to each series per issue. These manga magazines, or "anthology magazines", as they are also known (colloquially "phone books"), are usually printed on low-quality newsprint and can be anywhere from 200 to more than 850 pages long." [from wikipedia]

If Marvel and DC insist on having us buy 5-10 titles a month just to keep up to date, why not save us some hassle and print anthologies?

I love you Greg Hatcher!

Being a man who only reads trades I am in complete agreement - because at the moment, even trades don't really do it for me.
Outside of comic reading, I do have a life. I work, I have friends, and every so often I like to get laid. With all that, and more, going on in my life, remembering what happened in the last trade of Y: The Last Man isn't high on the priority list. I like reading it, but I really have trouble remembering all the little nuances, and hints towards what might be coming next - and the trades aren't large, so I've normally finished it within side an hour or two.

However, I took a chance once and paid $35 bucks ($15 more than a Y trade) for the Invincible HC. 12 or 13 issues it was, and it although it's to be continued, it told a complete story, and 6-7 months later, I can still remember where it ended, because it was a complete story.
(It could have done without the red headed love intrest though, but that's just because I was trying to forget one at the time).

I would be insanely happy if every book had a big 12 issue HC once a year - it would be the perfect reading format for me. If I get a complete story, I'm actually more inclined to pick up the next volume, whereas I'm not for incomplete one's - I've had many a series fall by the way side, not because they were bad, but just out of apathy - I didn't want to spend the money to get the next part of the chapter (Noble Causes for instance, not enough bang in trade form, but with a HC's I'd still be getting it. 100 Bullets I stopped after trade 7, it's just not fun to read because I just can't remember what happened several months ago when I read the collection before it).
Bone I couldn't be bothered collecting in trade, but now that huge collection is out, I'll not only be getting myself a copy, but one for a friends b'day, because I know he likes the character, but didn't want to pay $20 bucks a trade.

Also, complete stories, no matter the length, from the likes of AiT/Planetlar, Oni and whoever put out Cyclone Bill, get more re-reads from me, because if I like a story I don't mind re-reading it.
I do get annoyed re-reading parts of chapters - it's pointless.

Also as a good side point, if they did just do big collections, think of all those series that got cancelled for moving too slow while trying to tell the bigger story.
I truly believe that lots of people dropped Outlaw Nation for being too slow, and not having good cliffhangers (fair enough).
But if the first12-13 issues had been released as one, it would've gone through the roof - it was a whole chapter, if not act. It was there that the series really took direction, sadly, it was cancelled soon after.

So yeah, when it comes to format, the bigger the better I say.

As someone who grew up far far away from any comic book shop I started off with trades (well I started off with The Beano, but the columns about the mainstream American publishers), I didn't really start to read the monthlies until the start of the whole 'writing for the trades' thing so I felt a little put off paying more for installments of a trade swamped in adverts. Now there's plenty of logic in putting out the continuing adventures of a character as a monthly serial, but I find it bizarre that most miniseries are put out monthly before being collected, wouldn't it be a better idea to free the creators from the rules of a format that isn't necessary and just put out a graphic novel.

It's justified if the separate issues are more worth owning than the trade. The second Volume League of extraordinary Gentlemen singles are lovely in of themselves as objects, Oni publishes their mini-series in a larger form (still free from adverts) as single issues, and Demo works much better as a series of mini graphic novels with extras than as a short story collection, but in most cases it seems kind of a waste of money for the costumer and the publisher.

I'm sure most creators would be happy with the change and the freedom it allows to. Alot of criticism on 'decompression' stems from fans belief that the writers are padding out their work and make as much money from a few limited ideas as possible, but, while this may be the case for some, lots of creators are just trying to make use of pacing and storytelling techniques that the singles format doesn't support as well as a graphic novel would. When Gaiman's 'Kindly ones' arc in Sandman was released in monthly format many hated it, but as a trade it's a wonderful experience to read. Wouldn't WE3 have been better as a oversized european format graphic novel? The Loeb/Sale books? The Ultimates as a book serial?

It seems to make a lot more sense for the creators and readers, but the publishers can't do it simply because that's not how the mind boggling world of the comics marketplace works. You would have thought that a community known for it's dedication to collecting would appreciate a beautifully printed book, but apparently not, the marketplace just want's the exact same format with no deviation, it's strange, like a whole sub-culture suffering from autism.

Well that didn't really make any novel points, or ,y'know, sense, but I've been typing for too long to bin it now.

I've been pondering format changes a bit as of late too. There are certainly a few series which I've often wondered why they aren't made trade/digest only as the majority of their readership comes from that (such as Runaways, Sentinal, or Spider-girl). I think the devotion to monthlies comes largely from being a "try it before you buy it" culture. We want to see a show on TV before we commit to the dvd boxset, we want to download an entire tracklist before actually buying the cd and we want to read the book (or at least part of it) before we commit to buying it. There's bound to be a better way of tapping into that than what we have presently though.

The U.S. manga fandom has benifited hugely from scanlations that build a reader base before material is actually liscenced but that doesn't really work for U.S. material. Perhaps a download service to build interest in the trades or a cheap magazine anthology? There'd also have to be a shift in the manner that they presently go about handling their properties as well, certainly a shift away from the line-wide "shared universe" stuff. Perhaps they could set up specific series/lines for those types of stories (JLA, Avengers) and keep the others distinct.

My own buying habits are a little mixed at the moment, I'm buying more trades than I used to and less monthlies (I do love Nextwave, Godland, and AS Superman though) but buy more manga volumes than U.S. material. Part of this is because I HATE the clunky size of the majority of western trades, it's fine for the floppies but it's cumbersome in a larger format. A second reason for this is because it's a better value seeing as how I can buy 2 for the cost of a regular trade. I do really like the Showcase/Essential format however, as there's alot of material there for the money and the binding isn't as "prestige" as the normal trades thus making them easier to flip through.

A problem (at least to comic business owners) is that trades are ridiculusly cheaper to buy online than in store, and because they are complete stories instead of cliffhangered chapters not stimulating weekly trips, there would likely be a mass exodus of the hardcore fan base. Zilla himself, just to name an example, buys all of his trades online besides a couple trades, but has weekly rushes to the shop for the singles.

It changes the entire nature of the game to release most stories as graphic novels or albums, if that is what you are suggesting. If you want more format diversity in mainstream titles, well, welcome to any medium, be it movies, music, or novels. The major conflict I see in your column is with art for the sake of business instead of art for the sake of art, a problem with any medium, but I agree that the audience of comics encourages that format tunnel vision as you suggest, because it's a serial format where the segments aren't broadcast into everyone's house at the same time, like television, so Wednesday rushes to the shop are required to read what happens next first, instead of punctuality to a TV set.

Interesting discussion that's been started.

Cheeseburger said:

"I was thinking along the same lines the other day that older crossovers like Secret War and Infinity Gauntlet didn’t have as many tie-in titles as stuff today does (someone I’m sure will correct me). So you could have regular monthly titles but when you want to do something Cosmic or have a Crisis then do it all at once in a longer format and just hype the hell out of it."

I'll correct you, since I'm actually writing a book on the subject (no, really, I am...yes, I probably am crazy...) There's no real correlation between crossover length and age. Secret Wars II and Millennium, to name a couple, both had mass promotions that tied into every single "in-continuity" book being published at the time (Millennium had fewer because it only lasted two months, but still had plenty), while Maximum Security, for example, was relatively small-scale. Certainly the two current/recent ones, 'Infinite Crisis' and 'Civil War', are biggies, but then again we had very few crossovers at all since 2000, so they can be forgiven a bit of excess.

As for the idea--I like it, but I have this vague, worried feeling that there's something we're all missing that would spell DOOM for the industry if it were tried. But I can't put my finger on it at all. Perhaps it's just that it sounds remarkably similar to the way CrossGen ran things?

Then again, CrossGen also had Mark Alessi as its founder and public face, which was what kept me from buying books from them almost right up until their bankruptcy, so who knows if their business plan was the problem?

I do like the idea of releasing minis as graphic novels right away. It irks me to no end that there are so many Batman mini-series, for example, when 'Legends of the Dark Knight' was supposed to cover that sort of thing. Either make them a GN or put them in LOTDK, I say.
So yeah, I'm all for replacing minis with trades, but NOT ongoing titles.
Interesting points about crossovers, John Seavey... I was thinking a few weeks ago that as much as people whinge and moan about crossovers like IC as though they're a recent phenomenon, the yearly events that DC have been running for ages have always been fairly intrusive. And at least IC and Civil War have titles dedicated to them that you can follow, unlike, say, 'Knightfall' or any of the other crossovers that took over the Bat-books in the 90s. Hell, Superman made an editorial policy out of having to read four books to keep up with the story for years.

Rohan Willimas said "I was thinking a few weeks ago that as much as people whinge and moan about crossovers like IC as though they’re a recent phenomenon, the yearly events that DC have been running for ages have always been fairly intrusive. And at least IC and Civil War have titles dedicated to them that you can follow, unlike, say, ‘Knightfall’ or any of the other crossovers that took over the Bat-books in the 90s."

I had thought that the lack of big crossovers had been due to back lash at the amount we had to go through in the '90s, and that really puzzles me.
Marvel went bankrupt, and hit really low reader levels.
They built themselves back up by doing business differently to the '90s (remember when Joe Q used to say he liked to stay the hell out of the writers way?), and once they got goin steady, they decide to do all the tricks which lost them a lot of readers in the first place.

"Hell, Superman made an editorial policy out of having to read four books to keep up with the story for years."

Don't remind me--it's been hell, trying to decide which Superman crossovers are landmark events that deserve to be in a book on crossover history, and which are small-scale, organic stories that don't. And Batman, don't get me freaking started on Batman...um, but I digress. (Actually, I feel very sorry for the people who plan these things, because they have to walk a very nasty tightrope. If they integrate the books too closely, one chunk of readers screams, "I hate being forced to buy all these tie-ins to figure out what's going on!" If they make the stories too stand-alone, another chunk of readers screams, "I hate buying tie-ins that have almost nothing to do with the crossover!" It's a no-win situation.)

One interesting thing they tried during CrossGen's run, which might be of note here--remember their monthly trades that collected several of that month's books in a single digest? It'd be interesting to see that...a monthly Marvel Digest/DC Digest that collected the previous month's issues of five or six titles. Of course, this does the exact opposite of what Greg suggested, giving us several non-self-contained stories in a single volume instead of one self-contained story, but it is kind of a neat idea...

I truly didn't mean the last one to come out condescending, Rohan -- that was more frustration at the column itself not being what I wanted. I was getting a little excited about the idea by the end and probably should have slowed down.

Comments are all interesting and keep it up, folks... but what's weird to me is that no one has answered either the question of WHY serialization is necessary, or WHY comics must remain at the same size and format.

It's fiction. There's no need for it to be in periodical installments except that we INSIST ON IT. The arguments for keeping it installments-every-Wednesday are tantamount to a junkie explaining why he HAS to visit his dealer.

An argument that hasn't been raised here, but I've heard it elsewhere, is that going to an all-graphic-novel kind of format throws mainstream comics retailers under a bus. To which I answer, how is that any different than the way Marvel and DC treat them NOW? They already insist shop owners be psychic by ordering what they THINK will be big 3 months from now on a non-returnable basis. I think making the leap to being actual bookstores like a Borders or a Barnes & Noble that specializes in comics probably would work out better in the long run. But I'm just some guy with a column -- if any actual retailers want to address that, I'd love to hear that perspective.

My one suspicion as to why it won't, yet oh so will work:

Serialized installments = ready cash at hand every month (this is for the publisher, not the retailer/fan).

Serialized installments + trade paperbacks = Ready cash, plus lotsa extra cash when the deal is done (very nice deal, the way Charles Dickens did all his work).

Trade paperbacks only = Cash at some unspecified future point when the deal is done, but no cash while you're working on it (scary uncertain future for freelancers).

So nobody's just going to make the leap to "only doing graphic novels", because those small doses of monthly cash get addictive. Instead, what I think we'll see is what we're seeing now--a gradual increase in popularity of the trade, a gradual decrease in interest in the serialized issues, until finally the serialized format becomes unprofitable relative to the potential profits involved in a TPB issuing. Probably the two will co-exist for a while--long-running series, like 'Action' and 'Detective', will keep going monthly, while mini-series will stop being mini-series at all and will just be released as graphic novels. Why release a four-issue series when everyone is just saying, "Nah, I'll wait for the trade"?

In other words, I think that what you're suggesting is already happening, but that it's probably unwise to try to accelerate the pace too much. (Except insofar as it gets DC to finish collecting 'Hitman'. F***ing loved that series.)

"...what’s weird to me is that no one has answered either the question of WHY serialization is necessary, or WHY comics must remain at the same size and format."

I think serialization is needed (at least psychologically) for the mainstream stuff because humans are creatures of habit and the weekly "quick fix" is something we look forward to as part of our regular routines. It can work though. Since 52 came out, I've flipped through it and was kind of like "meh." However, in a recent issue one of the characters wakes up from a coma or something and starts shouting "52! 52." I think it is interesting that the 52 thing has another layer of meaning rather than just filling in 52 weeks. It works soley because it is serialized in the weekly format. It was a very novel idea.

As to size, again it's just what we're used to. If you went into Wendy's and asked for a hamburger and it came out and it was triangular in shape (bun and all), it would be a little off putting (granted you'd probably still eat it, but it's early and I'm hungry and it was the only analogy I could come up with). Same thing with comics. I recently picked up the three volumes of Scott Pilgrim (excellent series), which are digest sized and about 100 pages. Though they are part of a 6 volume work and thus somewhat serialized, they are quite satisfactory reads, each having a beginning middle and end. This type of comic would be a really boring read as a monthy and works well in the bookish format.

Just my ramblings...

P.S. Thanks for the correction to the tie-ins of yesteryear John Seavey. I was trying to come up with examples but the earliest stuff I remember was the Infinity War and Knightfall crossovers.

I have to go in the opposite direction here.

I think the loss of the 22-page monthly would be a great shame. It's as valid a format of storytelling as anything else- that it's not used as well is the problem, but I don't think abandoning it is the answer.

Besides, from a financial perspective, it'd raise the price point and lose readers because people wouldn't be able to "sample" a title without a much larger buy-in. It'd be like if LOST stopped airing on ABC and just went straight to DVD boxsets.

"Besides, from a financial perspective, it’d raise the price point and lose readers because people wouldn’t be able to “sample” a title without a much larger buy-in."

However, most people, myself included (most recently the first 4 weeks of 52), end up sticking with a book for 6 issues or more for the sole purpose of making the decision of whether we want to KEEP buying it. Rarely, I think, does a comic reader get one issue and judge whether or not they will continue with it based on it. Granted the $$$ is spread out over several months, but it still works out the same.

Well, that's how I work, obviously YMMV. I picked up one issue of YOUNG AVENGERS, wasn't too keen on it. Granted, the low price point affects my judgement slightly- if I just sort of like something, I might pick up the next issue to see if the quality keeps up (I got into SHE-HULK this way.)

A couple of points:

1) The dimensions of the monthly issues probably have something to do with paper supplies. Book publishers spend a lot of time dealing with paper issues with the printer. Since the tried 'n' true current size has been around so long, the publishers may be leery of change. They can also get cheaper prices by buying in huge quantities. The printers would be very reluctant to publish in more than 2 or 3 different sizes. The paper supply hassles probably aren't worth it.

2) Most fiction book publishers operate in a hit and miss fashion. Lots of publishers take a loss on 19 out of 20 titles, waiting for that one best-seller that makes it all back plus more. I don't see DC and Marvel operating that way.

That should be "the publishers would be very reluctant to publish in more than 2 or 3 different sizes."

Wow, Greg. I think this is your best column yet, and provoked a lot of interesting thoughts. I've been thinking about format for ages, and I haven't found one perfect solution. But that's just it. There doesn't have to be.

First off, though, let me say that that issue of Thor looks awesome. I must get it. Eventually, I plan to have read every issue of Thor. Thanks to the Essentials it won't be so hard getting the earliest issues. Yes, that's right, I'm a Thor whore. You've found me out.

Moving on. I'm not a weekly consumer of comics, I avoid crossovers, and I don't consider myself a "collector." If I did, I'd probably bag and board my comics and have long boxes or whatever. But I don't, I have one-and-a-half filing cabinets, several paper boxes, and loose piles of comics sitting about. Yes, my laziness tends to override my mild obsession-compulsion. So, you know, I'm not really the market's target audience.

But even though I grew up in the age of the comic shop, I still bought random comics at the grocery store. Hell, even when I went to the fabled comic shop, the most glorious place on Earth, where, when you walked in, one whiff of its magic could cure any malady, I still just bought whatever looked good, and spent most of my time rifling through quarter and dime boxes looking for gold. I rarely actually followed a series for more than two issues, until I discovered the subscription. Each issue, back then, was still an experience, a window to wonder. But now, look at me, I've been partially assimilated, and now I buy entire series and sit on the internet, cynical and jaded about the entire industry.

As said above, shifting into an all-book industry would finally kill the comic shop dead. Hell, I already buy all my trades and graphic novels off of Amazon because it's far cheaper; if we moved to all-books, I wouldn't need to step into a comic shop.

However, as I denoted above, the single issue (which I like calling a "single" rather than "pamphlet" or whatever terms other people use) used to be an experience in and of itself, and I sincerely think the industry needs to go back to that. Look at Fell. Each issue is a complete story, and a damn good one at that. Ellis knows how to utilize a single, even if he's chastised for being too decompressed in other stuff he writes. It's not his fault if he writes OGNs and Marvel publishes them as singles first. If it's something he has complete publishing control over, like Fell, or his GNs like Switchblade Honey, he'll do it in the format it's intended for. Ahh, if only all comics were like that.

I call myself a writer, yes. I've got loads of ideas for comics, all in a wide variety of formats. There doesn't have to be just one or two formats, you know... You've got the Scott Pilgrim/Street Angel trade format, where it's slightly bigger than a manga with better paper, you've got the French comics album format, around 44 to 46 pages (or the size of two American singles, and yes, it sounds like I'm referring to cheese; there's a metaphor in there somewhere, but I've no room to fully flesh it out)... and then there's your regular American graphic novel, or your phone book, or your manga, or your anthology, or umpteen other things.

That's what I want to see; graphic novels of all sizes, and singles that tell complete experiences, even if some plots continue to further chapters. Of course, the single could be anywhere from 22 to 80 pages, as far as I'm concerned.

And no, I don't care about *when* a comic comes out... while the weekly/monthly schedule is so vastly important to a number of fans, I couldn't give a toss. This is why I don't mind when a book is late. Besides, it saves me money, and I'm a cheapskate.

Speaking of manga a bit above, by the way, I've only just really "discovered" it. While I can't see myself picking up regular volumes of ten bucks each, the three volumes of Iron Wok Jan I got for a quarter each are just lovely little art objects. It was worth it teaching myself to read right-to-left.

So, did I make a point here? Even I'm not sure. I do know, however, that there isn't one perfect comics format, and that we've got to break the industry out of its idiotic mentality in regards to said formats. And when I start getting some comics published, I plan to have them done in the format for which they were intended, be they singles, albums, or graphic novels of varying shapes and sizes. Format, I feel, is important. Maybe I'll use an idea Ellis talked about, once, and put out a nice thick single with cover flaps. Hmm.

Jordan D. White: Plus, there ARE still books Marvel publishes that work well as issues: Cable & Deadpool, She-Hulk, Marvel Team-Up, FNH Spider-Man(when not a crossover)

Yes, but all of those titles sell abysmally (except for Spidey... but, you know, it's sales are due to crossovers. And it may be the lowest-selling Spidey title that isn't Marvel Adventures). Which, methinks, is odd. (The only issue of Marvel Team-Up, I bought, however, was hideously padded for the arc, so I can't see the argument there, but whatever.)

Cheeseburger: Rarely, I think, does a comic reader get one issue and judge whether or not they will continue with it based on it.

Except me, of course, but I'm evil. I've tried to relax this policy-- I gave OYL Aquaman and Hawkgirl two issues, and I'm tempted to give them a third each, but then I realize I'm far away from my regular comic shop until late August and when I go back I'll be dropping sixty bucks... So you see, I don't feel like spending the money on issues I probably won't like anyway. But normally, if a comic can't hook me in one issue (usually the first issue of a run or title), then it's dead to me.

Wow, that was a whopper of a reply, wasn't it? Yowza.

"As said above, shifting into an all-book industry would finally kill the comic shop dead."

Which would be a shame really because lots of the guys running the store have such a love for the medium and want to take part in it in the only way they can - by selling stuff. There must be a way to spread the word in bookstores but help the LCS owners as well.

My idea is package these novels kind of like a DVD. The bookstores and Amazon would get the basic novel whereas Comic Shops would get that and "special Editions" with creator commentary and the like. If the price could be set the same for each that would be a bonus.

Just a thought

Cable and Deadpool a good monthly? I just gave that up for the trades because it was too hard to follow the individual issues (even if there are self-contained stores, the underlying premise is hard to follow monthly). If stories are written for a trade format, that's how I plan to buy them from now on (with the present exception of Eternals and my need for a Neil Gaiman fix).

Also, here's something interesting my local comic book store owner wrote in his last summary of the Previews catalog that relates to why we won't see serialization go away:
"Warning: Charlie-Rant Ahead: See, the advertising revenue generated by the sale of the monthly comics is what pays the artists; the trade paperbacks are more profitable to the publisher than the creators. So, without high monthly sales the publisher can't get the advertisers to generate the income to pay the creators. I'm not trying to discourage TP sales; that's almost all I have in my collection and that's the way I read 'The Losers' and also how I read '100 Bullets' because they're too involved for me to carry all the details and characters month to month in my head. But those monthly stapled pamphlets that we stick in bags and boards are what keep the industry going."

I also say don't kill the single, but don't do it the way it's done now.

Warren Ellis had a fairly good discussion about the Single at the Pulse:

http://www.comicon.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=39;t=000138

He is in favor of the "chapters of a graphic novel" which I am too, but that also means "part of a complete story" not just a part of a larger story...

The other format of course is to have complete stories in 22 pages. (Which obviously Warren is doing with Fell, with even fewer pages)

It's ridiculous to have Superman or Batman or Spider-Man stories that are spread out over more than 2 issues. Especially since DC and Marvel will never let too much to change. It's like watching a Simpsons story spread out over 6 episodes. Who wants to see that?

It just seems better (for those iconic characters) to give a complete monthly dose of spandex action. And you can have the occasional Dark Knight Returns or Superman for All Seasons published as a mini-series that will later be collected.

I also grew up reading from the newsstand - in the 90's, and I can related to the "to be continued..." box as the first sign of rip-off, but I'm against the idea of graphic novels only. I like being able to pick up an individual issue and sample to see whether it'll be worth following for a while. Part of this is coloured by the fact that I've never read a graphic novel I've liked that wasn't published as individual issues first and that if I'm putting down $30-40 for a comic book I'm going to have pretty high expectations - and they're probably not going to be met. Four bucks per month with the option of bailing out anytime is just fine for me.

Cheeseburger: Rarely, I think, does a comic reader get one issue and judge whether or not they will continue with it based on it.

Which is a problem. As an audience, we're one of the least discerning ones on the planet. You don't see the movie audience waiting for a sequel to "Battlefield: Earth" because they still haven't made up their minds about the first one.

I think the biggest hinderance to the evolution of the media is the fact that the majority of us became fans as kids. Because of that, we have a tendency to idolize the creators, which encourages the habit of buying out of duty, rather than interest. And then there's the element of nostalgia, which not only colors our memories of what came before, but drives us to pester the publishers to recreate the past for us, and satisfy our rose-colored yearnings. No one wants to let their memories go, but we get angry if it's the same thing over and over again.

It's actually quite akin to the way a junkie operates, always trying to get back to how that first high felt, but unwittingly making each high less significant and further from the ideal, by using more often and more heavily.

Philip said, "I've never read a graphic novel I've liked that wasn't published as individual issues first." First, a graphic novel never exists as individual issues first, because then it's not a graphic novel, and if you'll forgive me, that's just sad. For you, I mean. There are so many great graphic novels out there that I feel bad for you.

Oh well, maybe I should have said "trade" or a "book-length comic." And no need to feel sad, I'm satisfied with the "book-length" comics I've got. Maus reads just as well in installments as in trade form, the same with Acme Novelty Library and Red Rocket 7.

An example of a complete GN originally published as single issues is Watchmen, which is clearly an example of a well-contained story.

Personally, I don't buy floppies, and always wait for trades. I can't stand the proliferation of books dedicated to the same characters, and think that the "novels in a shared world" approach would be fantastic.

"You don’t see the movie audience waiting for a sequel to “Battlefield: Earth” because they still haven’t made up their minds about the first one."

True, but a movie isn't 30 minutes either. I don't think this is a great analogy as to compare the current state of comics to movies, you would have to look at the whole story arc then form an opinion about THAT on whether or not you'll get the next arc.

Someone mentioned the Simpsons and I was thinking about this too. The Simpsons has next to no continuity yet continues to be popular. Why can't the same be done with comics?

"I don’t think this is a great analogy as to compare the current state of comics to movies, you would have to look at the whole story arc then form an opinion about THAT on whether or not you’ll get the next arc."

You really don't need to read a whole four-to-six issue arc to know if it's worth getting; a writer's grasp of plot, pacing, and characterization are pretty apparent by the end of 22 pages. Storytelling quality doesn't usually vary that wildly over the course of the average arc; as a general rule, if you don't like the first issue of a given creative team on a given book, you're probably not going to like the rest of the story they tell.

This is yet another instance where comic book readers really do seem less rational than most consumers. Who says, "I really didn't like that episode, but I think I'll watch the show for the next several weeks just to see if it starts getting good"?

Cheeseburger: "I think serialization is needed (at least psychologically) for the mainstream stuff because humans are creatures of habit and the weekly “quick fix” is something we look forward to as part of our regular routines"

That may be the case for some humans, but not all. Many, like myself, have made the change to trade only, and they come out irreguarly.
As I said before, personally I'd like a big volume a year.
A lot of fantasty Authors with series do that, and they sell in the truck loads.
Take Raymond E. Feist for instance - he has me hooked even though I haven't enjoyed his last several books as much as the originals, and he releases like clockwork one a year.
Why can't comics do that?

Cheeseburger: "However, most people, myself included (most recently the first 4 weeks of 52), end up sticking with a book for 6 issues or more for the sole purpose of making the decision of whether we want to KEEP buying it. Rarely, I think, does a comic reader get one issue and judge whether or not they will continue with it based on it. Granted the $$$ is spread out over several months, but it still works out the same."

When I brought singles, and with trades, you only get one shot to impress me.
If I wasn't satisified, but saw potential, I'll flick through the next volume before picking it up.
I'd alsolike to quibble with "most people".
Maybhe that's what you and your friends do, but sales figures show that people will pick up a first issue, but not nessecarily a second.
If a writer doesn't have the skills to grab me with their first issue, then they just don't have enough skill for my taste.
Which is another arguement for bigger books - I've read many books where I didn't like the first chapter, but pushed on, as I already have the whole book, and quite enjoyed it.
With singles I don't do that, because it would cost me more money to see what happens next.

Wow - Greg, what a great column. I stumbled across your column last week, and this is two in a row that has provoked several HOURS of discuss and thought in my household.

I know that I, personally, get a mix of TPB and single comics right now. Pretty much, anything by my favorite authors, I'm getting every month - Peter David, Warren Ellis, and a few others. Other stuff that I like, I'm going to get in TPB form. One example of that is Ultimate Spider-Man, which I'm slowly picking up in those beautiful hardcovers.

I don't think the "sampling" issue is a particularly relevant one. People don't get an opportunity to "sample" regular novels - I'm not aware of the DaVinci Code publishing individual chapters anywhere, for instance. People buy it, or get it from the library, based on what they read in reviews or hear from friends. A novel that doesn't get good reviews like that simply doesn't sell, whether it's in Borders or Amazon or not. A great novel is going to sell as word-of-mouth spreads.

And, novelists also publish novels, not necessarily knowing if they're going to make money or not. How many people try to make it in the novel-writing business every year, only to fail? The guys that people like, that sell comics - the Brian Bendises of the world, for instance - are going to sell graphic novels and TPBs as well. If the format ever switched to a novelization form permanently, you'd have a similar function as happens in contemporary fiction - the Dan Browns, the John Grishams, the Stephen Kings of the world sell a LOT of novels on their name alone. The Harry Turtledoves get through to their niche market, and so on.

Pretty much, though, this might not necessarily drive the local comic book store out of business. Besides being a gathering place for local comics geeks, it does give a place for local gamers to gather - I know that my local store packs the place for their weekly Magic, Yu-Gi-Oh & other tournaments. This would require local comic book stores to come up with an alternative way to run their business, because they would NOT be able to compete with their local Borders, Wal-Marts and Amazons.

Perhaps it’s just that it sounds remarkably similar to the way CrossGen ran things?Then again, CrossGen also had Mark Alessi as its founder and public face, which was what kept me from buying books from them almost right up until their bankruptcy, so who knows if their business plan was the problem?

Now it can be told: here is where the impetus for this column came from. Three or four years ago, doing press coverage for Jonah at the San Diego Convention, I drew the short straw and got sent to Alessi's roll-out panel publicizing his "comics on DVD" with trailers and demos and so on. To me the whole thing looked a lot like the old Marvel Superheroes cartoons-that-don't-move shorts from the mid-60's (available now at a convention bootlegger near you, for the morbidly curious.) I dutifully wrote it up and Jonah published it, you can probably find it in the CBR News archives somewhere.

Well, we all know what happened to CrossGen. But I quite liked Ruse and I remembered how excited Alessi and his minions were about this DVD project so when my local shop had a bunch of them marked down to a couple of bucks in the budget bin I picked up Meridian on a whim. (I had a vague memory of our friend Lorinda liking that title so I thought why not?) Seven issues on the DVD -- more than the first trade, I think -- and the story went NOWHERE. Glaciers move faster than this story. And at the end of some 70 minutes of cartoon (that didn't move) it said, "To Be Continued..."

Now, I'm 44, I bought it mostly because it was cheap and one of the extras was a how-to on drawing comics I can use in my kids' cartooning class... but I got to thinking how LIVID I would have been if I was a mother who'd bought this for her kid. Or if I'd been a fifteen-year-old who was really into fantasy stories and dragons and stuff and been hooked by the back cover synopsis. Remember the full price on it new was something like 14.99. For that kind of dough I'd think you have the right to expect your DVD to be COMPLETE.

And then it occurred to me that we NEVER expect that in comics, and that was what led Alessi to his distorted expectation. You can't apply in-comics economic logic to the outside world, even in comparable entertainment media, because IT'S INSANE. There came the column.

And Bill, that Thor story rocked WAY hard. It was during Len Wein and John Buscema's tenure on the title and Wein wrote some very fun stories there; I am counting the days till the Essentials catch up to it. That run also spun out the "Warriors Three" one-shot of Marvel Spotlight which may be one of my favorite comics ever.

End footnote.

Greg said...
"I truly didn’t mean the last one to come out condescending, Rohan — that was more frustration at the column itself not being what I wanted. I was getting a little excited about the idea by the end and probably should have slowed down."

No worries, mate, I think I read totally the wrong tone into the comment anyway. Again, great article as always, even if I don't totally agree with this one.
To me, the Crossgen thing is more evidence of what I'm talking about: even if you forced the publishers to release graphic novels exclusively, they wouldn't be real graphic novels, because the publishers would find a way to stretch the story out and make you buy the next one.

Some comics are meant to be serialised. Sure, move Bendis to trades-only if you want (not that Marvel would ever do it, because of the money they'd be afraid of losing), but I think a lot of comics- particularly superhero comics- have evolved out of that great tradition of the cliffhanger from film serials or tv shows. Unfortunately, thanks to the price of single issues, this has come to be an expensive tradition, but it's not going anywhere.

A world where stories were published according to the format that would be best suited for the story would be great, but that's a world where Flex Mentallo reprints are plentiful and Scott Pilgrim is sold in video game stores. Alas, such a perfect world does not exist. I've gained a lot of love for the single issue format in recent years, but still prefer trades and GNs as my main form of comics reading for a lot of reasons.

Despite how with you I am on the whole "completists ruin everything" sentiment, a lot of your argument doesn't really apply to me one way or the other, because I "wait for the trade" on most of the comics that are serialized GNs, because, hey, they're going to be a full GN or series of GNs at some point. Hell, I'm so spoiled with self contained GNs and the bulk of the Essentials that I barely even follow those kinds of books anymore (I haven't bought a Y trade since the second one, although I sort of intend to at some point).

I only get in to single issue serialization if it's a limited series or ongoing where there's an end to the run in mind (like Morrison's X-Men), and even then, it has to be for books that I absolutely cannot wait for the next issue of. Otherwise, I'll just get it in a trade a few months down the line. But I can't wait for something like 7 Soldiers or All-Star Superman (even though that will probably read really well as a complete package). Hell, it's pretty much just Morrison whose single issue stuff I follow. Morrison Morrison Morrison! (I'm not sure if he's been mentioned as often and fawningly around here as he was when he was more prolific, so I'm trying to correct that).

I forget where I was going with any of this, but good column as always, Greg. Gives me food for thought.

It's interesting going back and reading the archived "Fridays" column that in your very first article you mentioned that comics were in a transitionary period from serialized monthlies into bigger book format. Is it just the big crossover thing that broke the camel's back and made you post this now? As well, the Greg Hatcher of December 2005 seemed a bit more optimistic in nature that the Greg Hatcher of June 2006

Everyone should read the archived columns!

Lots of great stuff!

Excellent column. I stopped reading monthly books years ago, and one of the main reasons was the so-called decompressed storytelling. When I was reading DC in the '70s, a two-issue story was a big deal, and a four-issue story like "Who Took the Super Out of Superman?" was a true epic. Post-Crisis, Bizarro's first appearance was dragged out over five-issues. The old books would've covered the same ground in twelve pages.

I stopped reading "The X-Men" for similar reasons. What was the point of continuing if I couldn't follow the storyline without buying "New Mutants," "X-Factor" and whatever Wolverine miniseries was out that month?

These days, I buy TPBs exclusively, and even then, I generally avoid the new stuff. Story considerations aside, even a collected version of something like "Infinite Crisis" would be a less-than-fulfilling experience without the crossovers.

"Is it just the big crossover thing that broke the camel’s back and made you post this now? As well, the Greg Hatcher of December 2005 seemed a bit more optimistic in nature that the Greg Hatcher of June 2006 ..."

Well, I have had six months of watching industry decisions that seem to get progressively stupider and stupider, and fans that seem to DEMAND the mainstream drop any idea of opening up to new readers or new formats if it means sacrificing their precious shared-universe continuity. I'm the surly one on the blog -- I blame the current dangerously-inbred readership for things most pundits blame publishers for.

I'm basically optimistic about comics as a form. I'm even pretty optimistic about superhero/fantastic-adventure comics. But I'm not terribly optimistic about Marvel or DC doing anything soon that I'm really going to like a lot, given current trends, and the things that seem to sell in (comparatively) big numbers.

An interesting number I read in Wizard a few months ago was that Captain America #1 had upwards of one million copies in circulation in 1941! This is compared to 250k of Civil War #1 ordered in 2006. That's a pretty impressive difference in both #;s and era. This must be a result of the shrinking comic readership - being mainly made up of the hardcore addicts rather than being snatched up by kiddies at the super market (close to wartime might be a factor too). Do you think so?

"One interesting thing they tried during CrossGen’s run, which might be of note here–remember their monthly trades that collected several of that month’s books in a single digest? It’d be interesting to see that…a monthly Marvel Digest/DC Digest that collected the previous month’s issues of five or six titles."
That’s what im talking about..for example I buy a lot of marvel but don’t read spidey(I lost intrest when he grew up)soo if marvel put out monthly digest of spidey that had all of last months issues in it..id buy spidey...the logic is this..i buy a lot of marvel almost all their books..the wife dosent get "comics" and she dosent get how much I pay for them...so this way id be able to buy books I cant afford or books im not normaly in to and get re hooked...this does sound good because I get runaways..because I got the digest for my daughter and one day I was bored read a small arc an decided to buy it regularly...this would to me build intrest in titles..for me as kid I loved buying back issues..but kids nowa days (at least none of my kids) get the "to be continued" my son thinks its weak we have to wait..wheres digest (or cartoon networks digest as well)tell a few stories or tell a complete story..my son loves the trades because he can sit down and get closure..so to him it’s a complete book..where as monthlies are not enough substance for him (am I making sence)

Butttt I think its because we hate to wait..i get mad when a book is late a month or 2 so waiting 6-9 months for the next chapter to come out would be murder for me..i grew up on monthies..im use to that monthly fix of FF or avengers would I but it sure I would..but id be more willing to buy it if it had chapters..ultimate x-men for eaxmple..when I got no new books ill grab a trade..i like that..but for all my books id go mad with waiting.

Also wouldn’t shops lose money? If all things were trades..then why would we need comic shops?? Wouldn’t marvel lose money as well I mean some fans buy the monthly and the trade(I did for astonishing x-men) when I go back to re-read an old arc/story line I love to grab a trade instead of taking each issue out then ..having to open another and another to read a whole story.. I do agree trades are cool but ..replace monthlies?? That’s crazy talk!!

I would love minis as a trade only...that would be soo cool..like x-23..or anialation(sp??)...even house of m..if they did that id buy more especialy if they keep doing these "buy 50 issues to get the whole story events!!" well id buy the whole story if some parts were in trade....but then some would be angry that they had to buy a 12.00 book to get the missing part of the story...but its still cheaper than buy each issue monthly..( I do this now..like when frontline mcv comes out ill get it )but as bill reed stated...that smell ..that comic shop smell ..thats like a mom hug when your 3. it comforts you.

But I still bought x-men through out the 90s so what do I know?

So yeah my votes for digest

And as to why??

Because I don’t want to wait a year for the next chapter...thats like tv shows and their season finale(when is lost coming back??!!)

And the shape/size?? I don’t know im an 80s kid and I got a ton of those marvel collections (like wmomen of marvel) size really dosent matter unless its page length.. also when alex ross did those dc books..the format was diffreent and it didn’t fit in my comic boxes...sooo the comic box makers are in cohoots with marvel to enslave us all!!!

Dam that’s long/

You're absolutely right, Greg, and I agree with you 100%... on one condition.

After you've freed yourself from the 7 x 10 32-page monthly shackles and transformed comics into true graphic novels, can you give that format back to the kids and impulse buyers?

Let the comic shops and bookstores be packed floor-to-ceiling with comic books of every shape and size; and let the corner crugstore have 7 x 10 32-page done-in-one all-ages comics at an affordable price, made as new-reader- and casual-reader-friendly as possible.

It doesn't have to be either/or. It can be both. Let the mature, sophisticated comics take on whatever format best fits the needs of the story, and let there be a cheap, accessible format to bring kids back into the fold.

"It doesn’t have to be either/or. It can be both. Let the mature, sophisticated comics take on whatever format best fits the needs of the story, and let there be a cheap, accessible format to bring kids back into the fold."

Oh, I agree absolutely, but MacQ already knows that, this is something we've talked about for years. But I'll put it on the record for everyone else too.

Although kids are reading all sorts of comics, my classes are full of them. They just don't read MARVEL AND DC comics. They think Spider-Man and Superman are movie characters. Which is a pity, or it would be if Marvel and DC had any interest in actually publishing kids' comics and I really don't see they do.

I do think that economics pretty much have killed the 32-pager as a single-issue kids' package. Too thin, too pricey. If kids are going to read comics we have to get them into at least the Tokyopop or Archie digest format. My surmise based on what I see in my kids' classes. They want books.

The answer, of course, is that there should be the monthly self contained short story for the comics geek who needs his / her weekly "fix" (as well as the kids, as MacQuarrie cites), and the original GNs separate.

Your students would be just as happy with self-contained short stories as you and I were when we were kids, Greg. They don't really care if it's 32 pages or 320 pages, as long as the whole story is there, they don't have to buy any more books if they don't want to, and the price is reasonable. It really is just that simple.

***********

I am trying to imagine how Marvel could work in this way. It’s not easy.

Sure it is. Let me show you.

Let's take Spider-Man, shall we?

Let's cut the releases down to AMAZING SPIDER-MAN and PETER PARKER, THE SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN. These will be our monthly titles, scheduled to be released bi-weekly.

Then I schedule four quarterly 200 page original self-contained GNs for the year. This means I'm going to have two AMAZING SPIDER-MAN and two PETER PARKER GNs out each during 2007. Follow?

Then I solicit creators for the GNs. I go to my current writers on the monthly books and offer them the gig first, letting them know up front that this will be their focus piece for the character and that if they take this assignment, I'm going to replace them as writer on the monthly series for 2007. They give me two cool ideas, and I buy them. I then schedule the art team - it could be the team from the monthly book, it could be a completely different team. But that will be the team for that writer's GN. I schedule the first AMAZING GN to be released in May 2007, and the first SPECTACULAR GN for July 2007. That gives the AMAZING GN team a maximum of 8 months to complete the story from today, and the SPECTACULAR team 10 months, given the necessary lead time for solicitations and production.

I then get two other creative teams and get them on board with two other GN ideas, and schedule them for October 2007 and December 2007 releases. Plenty of time for them to produce their books.

That covers my four original GNs.

Now, on to the monthlies.

Since AMAZING has May and October GNs, I schedule those two months to be produced by the respective creative teams as self-contained stories that had lead ins to their respective GNs, before they do the GNs. Same with PETER PARKER for July and December, respectively.

That leaves me with ten months open per title for the year.

In AMAZING, I hire my first creative team to write a four issue story arc to be released January to April. In May, I release a the one shot "fill in" by the GN team as the lead in story. From June through September, I have another four issue arc by either the same creative team as the Jan-April team, or a new team. In October, I do the one-shot fill in lead story for October's GN.

November and December I hire someone to do a two part story and close out the year. Then the cycle begins all over again.

For PETER PARKER, I either hire one team or two teams to do two three issue story arcs through June. In July, I have the one-shot set up story for the GN. For August-October, I have one more three issue story arc, and a fill in one shot for November before the set up story for the December GN.

That takes care of Spider-Man.

For any solo character book that only has one title (THOR, HULK, CAPTAIN AMERICA, IRON MAN, etc.), I can do two GNs a year, scheduled for releases four to six months apart, staggered, and keep the same three issue story arc system, with one issue set up for the GN as described above.

For the team books like AVENGERS or THUNDERBOLTS or what have you, I would probably make the arcs six issues long instead of three, and only do one GN a year.

The only real problematic books are the X-Titles, and that's a separate issue altogether that I would probably be tarred and feathered for no matter what I did with them.

The problem is, you really need to be able to schedule this sort of publishing system 12-16 months ahead of time, so by doing it now, I'd be racing the clock to put books out on time for 2007. If I were to schedule this for 2008, there would be far less problems. I also would likely be hiring a wider variety of talents, and when I collected my TPBs for each year, I would have 2-4 complete stories in each volume, instead of just selective issues for well received story arcs, which would be far better service to the "I'll get in trade" crowd and could be perceived as a better bargain by casual consumers, as they would think, "Hey, I'm getting multiple stories here, instead of just one!".

That takes care of the "obsessive" fans.

You also then have an "all ages / early teen" monthly title that is always a one-shot self contained book for whatever it is your releasing. And no, you don't have to have it in "DCU Animated" style art. It can be any art style and any writing style, as long as it's self contained and well done.

That gives you even more diversity and opportunity to offer to the talent pool, and gives something to the casual buyer who can get in on the ground floor like Jim MacQ wants, before you lead them to the arcs and GNs.

I don't think I can agree with the blatant assertion that today's kids would like 32-page self-contained issues as much as kids did back in the 60's. Kids today have more options are are used to even more bang for their buck. Why pay 4 bucks for a simple Spider-Man adventure when 8 bucks gets you 150 pages of One Piece or Naruto or whatever? To get kids back into singles, the prices would need to drop. Curiously, I think the way to do this would be to drop paper and coloring quality, abandoning the "widescreen" look that's been fashionable lately in the name of getting costs down. I'm pretty sure the die-hard collectors wouldn't stand for something like that.

Actually, publishers do not have to drop the paper or coloring quality. What they need to do is stop being lazy and only depending on one market - namely direct market comics retailers.

Comics have increased in price over the years not because of printing expenditures or the increase of page rates to creators, but because the ever-shrinking number of outlets the books are being sold to. You get the publishers to reinstate their mail order subscriptions. You get them to build their market through the newsstand again properly. Build the sales up by getting them back in the public eye, instead of hiding them in your little fanboy clubhouses, and then the price points will go down. The only problem is, the prices probably will stay where they are because they've not got the guts to lower them back to where they should be (about $1.50 cover price, comparably with the prices of most magazine price increases over the same time span).

And if worse comes to worse, you collect brand titles into anthology books and have higher page counts. But you don't need to have 100-300 pages per issue at $3-$4. 64 pages of story with some advertising space in there is more than sufficient.

As for NARUTO and ONE PIECE and most of the rest of the manga - most are reprints for their respective publishers. As such, the publishers don't pay the full going rate, only a reprint license fee. If Tokyopop or Del Rey actually had to pay equitable page rates to the creators for those materials, they wouldn't be any $8.95 retail, I assure you. They would be more around the price point of $24.95 a book retail, and Manga would be doing a whole lot worse in sales.

Hi Sam! Photos i send on e-mail.
Green

this is so dorky