Basic facts about the superguys should be known amongst the populace if the comic superguys are considered “known.” That’s only a handful of characters–Superman, Batman, Hulk, Spider-Man–and they are known because of TV and movies.

And this extends downwards, too. “Sorry, Blue Beetle. We’re going to ignore your evidence of a clear and present danger to the human race because you’re one of the Tiny Two Hundred Seventy.” “Oh, well, fair enough. I guess I’ll go get shot in the face, then.” It’s like under the Big Three (no, not Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman, Rucka/Johns/Winick), the super-heroes are all well aware of how popular they are among the fans, and behave accordingly.

Anyhoo…

Except for the Crimson Avenger.

Other than that you’re spot on, but if I don’t retentively nitpick stuff like that I lose my comic nerd-fu and start getting all distracted and start reading books and having a life and stuff.

I’d also posit that people are aware of Captain America and able to recognize him even without ANY knowledge of the character. The fact that “Captain America” has been used in lots of outside sources as a term (both positive and derogatory) for patriots, and the fact that he literally dresses in a flag. People can put two and two together, because even if “that guy in the blue suit with the stripes on his stomach” wasn’t named Captain America, he damn well should be. People would probably call him that anyway. But while any random sampling of people on the street would turn up folks who know Clark Kent, Peter Parker and Bruce Wayne, would anyone know Steve Rogers?

One (more) thing that Marvel does right that DC doesn’t is that they draw a strong line between their “real world” big characters and their “in-world” big characters. Out here in real life, we know that Marvel’s big chararacters are Spidey and Wolverine. But if you asked people that live in the MU, they’d say Captain America and Iron Man.

Meanwhile, we know Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman, and the people who live in the DCU know them too, even if it doesn’t make sense in the world of the comics. Pretend you’re telling a Silver Age-style story in which Batman and Alan Scott have both written books and are both having signings in Gotham City on the same day. If you wanted to be true to the world of the characters, then GL’s line should be ten times longer than Bruce’s, because DC denizens would be looking up to these oldtimers more than the new guys.

Basically, it’s fine for DC to publish books about the Big Three, but they shouldn’t tell stories about the Big Three.

I expect some historical quibbles with what I’ve written, but whether or not so-and-so really was the “first” (Wikipedia says Nelvana of the Northern Lights – remember her? – was the first comic book superheroine), my point is that these are the Ur-heroes who set models for much that came after. As with everyone else’s theory of the Big Three, Wonder Woman is the weak link in the argument. I think it’s worth noting that she’s the only one of the Big Three whose creation seems to have been inspired more by an intellectual conceit – girls need hero-models too – than by her creator’s wish-fulfillment fantasies (which is not to say that some of those famous early Wonder Woman tropes – bondage, anybody? – may not reflect William Moulton Marston’s fantasies).

My girlfriend has absolutely no interest in comics. Aside from Maus, I can’t be sure she’s even read one. So I figured she would be the perfect test subject to see what kind of recognition superheros have to someone who couldn’t care less. I sent her a list of the most famous, and asked her three questions, 1)Have you hear of them at all? 2)Would you recognize them on sight? 3)Do you know anything about their powers (what they are, how they got them)?

The only four she answered yes to all three for were Batman, Superman, Spider-Man and The Hulk. She could recognize WW, Aquaman, and Robin on sight, but knew nothing of their powers/origin. All the others were name recognition at best (she’d heard of The X-Men, but not Wolverine individually).

So, by those standards, both companies only have a “Big Two”. I know this is far from a legitimate sample size, but I think it shows that Cap and Wolvey aren’t quite as iconic as we might think.

I’d go with Spider-Man and the Hulk, but otherwise, meh. Captain America doesn’t have that much cachet with the kiddies.

What amazes me is how many people over 50 will recognize the symbol on my Shazam! t-shirt.

As far as comics go, keep in mind: Back in her early days, when comics themselves were a MUCH larger business, her titles (“Sensation Comics” and “Wonder Woman”) were HUGE sellers. I do believe that combined monthly sales reached seven digits in the ’40s. And she always had something else going for her that I don’t think you can find in any other female character since (except, arguably, Black Canary): her own identity. She’s not a distaff knock-off (like Supergirl, Batwoman, Batgirl, Spider-Woman, Spider-Girl, She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, etc. Even X-23!). Her unique status carries a significant currency in our pop culture (as it should). I can’t think of any other female hero with a solo title for whom that’s true.

Furthermore, going along with what some others have pointed out as DC redefining its company strategy (or “reinforcing their brand” or whatever they call it in corporate-speak), DC is preparing for a future which includes a(n alleged) return to glory for Wonder Woman, as evidenced not just by the upcoming All-Star title but by a little film to be made by Joss Whedon. They’re counting on a blockbuster. (They’d better get cranking because Marvel has been kicking DC’s ass with successful film adaptations.) I wouldn’t be surprised, once she’s established on the big screen, if we end up seeing a “Trinity” film (depending on the stars’ contracts). It’s a logical precursor (from their point of view) to building up their icons and perhaps even leading into a live-action “Justice League” movie.

Of course, all of this is a different discussion from the issue of why there’s a “Big Three” within the DC Universe itself. That’s a different thread, really. Although I’d argue (regardless of who should be on what list) that it’s only natural that some heroes would be considered A-list, B-list, C-list, by the media and the public of the DCU if not by the heroes themselves. (The more crass elements of celebrity within the hero community seem to have been repudiated by Booster’s story in “52.”)

And I’d bet if you took a survey of non-fans, Robin would be recognized more often than Wonder Woman.

Their status owes to the fact that they make LOTS of
money on licensing (movies, cartons, toys, underoos, you
name it). The only Marvel franchises who do the same are
Spider-Man and maybe the X-Men.

Best,
Hunter (Pedro Bouça)