Comments on: Joe Rice Media Review 1/11/07

By: Grant

Grant — Sat, 13 Jan 2007 00:16:25 +0000

Someday I hope someone will make the Citizen Kane of Giant Robot Fighting movies.

I doubt it will be Michael Bay though.

By: FunkyGreenJerusalem

FunkyGreenJerusalem — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 23:41:37 +0000

“But I think old school writers have a lot to learn from more recently displayed writing technologies”

Dragging an 8-page story out into six issues?

By: Joe Rice

Joe Rice — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:48:34 +0000

You know, I didnâ€™t think Thunderbolts was the best comic out there but I did enjoy it. That sort of storytelling should still have itâ€™s place alongside the stuff you like.

When done at least a bit more interestingly.

Personally, I think Warren Ellisâ€™ stuff is boring, obnoxious and pretentious. Mostly boring though. After a point I find trying to be shocked or whatever he is trying to accomplish in his writing just boring.

Let it be known that outside of NextWave’s fun, I haven’t enjoyed a Warren Ellis book since the first arc of Authority. I, too, find his repeated tropes boring. If you’re barking at the Ellis fan, that’s the other tree over there.

And most of the English writers are like that.

Really? Seriously? Alan Moore and Grant Morrison are boring shock-jocks? Is that what you’re saying here? Because that I cannot endorse in the slightest. What makes those two men excellent is the breadth of their imagination and the strength of their technical skills. They were marinated in comics of yore but learned to write in a more skillful manner.

Nicenza may not be a great writer either but heâ€™s the kind I can tolerate.

I’d frankly rather read a horrible writer than a tolerable one. Horrible can at least be interesting to critique.

By: Dean S.

Dean S. — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:03:49 +0000

You know, I didn’t think Thunderbolts was the best comic out there but I did enjoy it. That sort of storytelling should still have it’s place alongside the stuff you like. Personally, I think Warren Ellis’ stuff is boring, obnoxious and pretentious. Mostly boring though. After a point I find trying to be shocked or whatever he is trying to accomplish in his writing just boring. And most of the English writers are like that. He’s over the top, sometimes just to be over the top. That’s not really good writing. Nicenza may not be a great writer either but he’s the kind I can tolerate. I think if we combined the two writing styles we might actually have a good writer.

By: Joe Rice

Joe Rice — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:04:55 +0000

I’m replying again because I want to make clear I’m not one of these “Fun comics suck serious comics rule!” dorks. I’m a different dork. I actually can’t stand the stuff that came out of the “let’s imitate Ellis at Wildstorm” trend. DC’s rapey output is pretty gross. I enjoy clever, well-written comics. Most “old school” aren’t and most “new school” aren’t. But Thunderbolts has always stuck in my craw as this long-lasting testament to mediocrity. And the reception to Arcudi’s understated run just finished it.

By: Joe Rice

Joe Rice — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:57:19 +0000

You’re making a false dichotomy, Dean. I have no love for overly violent “new school” books either. My favorite superhero rag is All Star Superman. But there’s “taking what’s good about the old” and “writing as if you’re still in that time.” I think modern comics have a lot to learn from old school comics. But I think old school writers have a lot to learn from more recently displayed writing technologies. “Old school” is a bad term for stuff like Thunderbolts, in truth. It should be more like “boring and lacking in formal mastery.”

By: Dean S.

Dean S. — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:32:15 +0000

What is the problem with liking “old school” books? I don’t really enjoy all the “new school” books because they’re filled with characters with attitude and are usually overly violent. I already have too few comics to read, that I don’t understand someone wanting someone else to be upset because a comic they enojoyed has been totally changed. Of course maybe it’s the “new school” attitude. Oh, well, at least I know if you like a new comic, I won’t like it. Except Runaways. Until Joss Wheedon takes over.

By: Kevin Church

Kevin Church — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:24:54 +0000

I bet there’s a group of Marvel nerds who think the Fu Manchu reference was meant to be aimed at Shang-Chi, who was that character’s son as long as Marvel held the rights.

By: Mer

Mer — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:07:31 +0000

“Children of Men” is the next movie on my list. Glad to hear you liked it.

By: John Seavey

John Seavey — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:16:04 +0000

Personally, I think Venom would live about two days. “You’ve just killed twelve SHIELD agents, then signed on as a Thunderbolt to avoid prosecution. Now you’ve got electro-shock nanites in your bloodstream, controlled by…SHIELD agents.”

“Oops, my finger slipped.”

By: Joe Rice

Joe Rice — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:03:23 +0000

That’s the thing about satire though . . .you have to follow it through. You can’t have the commercial/news and then show realistic consequences based on actual human behavior. You’ve got to continue the satirized charicature.

By: Brian Cronin

Brian Cronin — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 05:55:26 +0000

Ellis is certainly being satirical with his take on the news and the commercial, but at the same time, while he’s being humorous, I think he is also trying to get across that the Americans in this comic book really DO feel this way about the Thunderbolts, so to THAT point, I think he’s playing it straight, and I think that’s a bit weird, that America would embrace the Thunderbolts this much.

As a strict joke, it is great – but I don’t think it’s just strictly a joke.

By: Joe Rice

Joe Rice — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:51:48 +0000

It’s not like anyone in the book is saying “Hey, let’s go hang out with Venom!” It’s a job. I don’t like being around some of my coworkers, but it’s my job.

By: The Mutt

The Mutt — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:46:15 +0000

I guess I’ll have to read this issue of Thunderbolts to figure out why anyone, anywhere, at any time, for any reason, would want to be in the same room with Venom.

By: Omar Karindu

Omar Karindu — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:25:27 +0000

Still not sold on Thunderbolts, alas, as if that did (or should) matter to anyone enjoying it. On a non-comics-related note, I must say I found your analysis of Talladega Nights dead on. Given that Sacha Baron Cohen's in it, I tend to treat it as the fictional companion piece to the pseudo-fictional Borat movie. Both are about exposing the prideful ignorance, shallow narcissism, and cheap triumphalism that seem to have infected much of America.

By: Tim Callahan

Tim Callahan — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:13:27 +0000

Yeah. Runaways. Here’s a story: It’s my son’s favorite comic book. I’ve read every issue of Volume 1 to him as bedtime reading and we’re just starting Volume 2. He’s 6 years old.

Yet, it’s also one of my favorite comic books as well.

Does that make me emotionally stunted, or does it make him incredibly sophisticated? Or both?