Comic Book Resources

I'm not a regular Spidey reader.

Am I understanding this correctly? Am I missing something? Did Peter choose to completely warp reality because Aunt May was dying?

That's it?

Seems a bit excessive.

What!? No more Normie Osborn!? Blasphemy! Or something.

I secretly held out hope that the writers would do a big 180 on what we all though, even though I knew better. And I figured the secret identity genie would be put back in the bottle somehow, but what really struck me as dumb was Harry coming back. Because it's not as if Harry was some "innocent" who was lost due to Spiderman. He was the friggin Green Goblin. Why exactly would MJ will that dude to come back to life? I know they were friends, but still. Dumb.

Unfortunatly, any drama of Spidey being unmasked by a villian or JJJ is gone now that we the readers have seen what exactly would happen if Spiderman were unmasked. Anything involving the secret ID is just underwhelming now. I personally liked the what Slott did in the Intiative a month or so ago, essentially stating how Peter Parker could have been one of the various Spidermen, and holograms..and other mumbo jumbo. Seemed to work better for me than "The Comics Code Won't Let Us Call Him Satan" waving his fingers just to piss off "The Comics Code Won't Let Us Call Him God".

So yes, I'm a sucker who read this entire arc and will read Brand New Day becasue I like the teams involved, but Jesus, I thought Marvel said they were above this level of Crisis convulution.

this seems really weird. how are they going to reconcile this with norman's activities in thunderbolts? and why is pete living with aunt may again, he's a grown man! did they de-age him too? to be honest, i don't really care about the marriage going by the wayside. pete living with his aunt again bothers me more.

I'd imagine that Brand New Day will go into specifics, T, but my guess is that Norman is still the Green Goblin, people just don't know he was the Green Goblin, except for Tony Stark. So Osborn will continue as T-Bolts leader, just without knowing Peter is Spider-Man.

As for Spidey living with Aunt May, odds are, May needs Peter to support her, hence them living together. That's not so odd, is it?

Doing a deal with Satan which erases your marriage, so steeped in unconditional love, and wipes out your future child to save a loved one. (Who, as others have pointed out, is an old woman!)

Not even the Goddamn Batman has gone that far and he's the benchmark for family obsessed nutjobs.

What's with DC acting like Marvel and Marvel acting like DC these days? I don't want that. Who does?

This all could have been a lot simpler, and a lot less... stupid. I'm sure any of us here could have come up with not only a better solution to retcon the marriage (if that really was necessary), but also a much better outcome.

Causing so much havoc just to save an old woman doesn't make any sense. Yes, May is immortal in comic book terms, but Peter and Mary-Jane should be mentally prepared for May's death, because she is elderly.

I know this is all in place to set up some fun stories for the semi-weekly book. I can live with that. What I don't get is, why couldn't we have had a good story to go with it? And, if there had to be such a convoluted DC-style fix, why couldn't it have been entertaining beyond the art?

It's a shame we can't just have stories end and start anew, in mainstream comics. I guess that's the price we pay for the excitement of a shared universe.

They do attempt to explain why Peter would be willing to trade all of that for May, and it is because May died because (remember, this is Peter's take on the events, it does not have to actually fit with what actually happened) of Peter, so that guilt would destroy him - and he would be no good to MJ anyways, because he would be too wracked with guilt.

So yes, I’m a sucker who read this entire arc and will read Brand New Day becasue I like the teams involved, but Jesus, I thought Marvel said they were above this level of Crisis convulution.

for some reason, that's the part i find most offensive... the way Joey Q crowed on and on about how Marvel doesn't "need" to reboot its characters because they're so durable and flexible and all that... and then he goes and throws a Superboy punch like this. it just seems so dishonest.

but as has been said before: it really doesn't matter because if it results in good stories, nobody will remember how dumb the vehicle to getting there was. and i was never a big fan of the marriage myself.

After reading that speech from Mephisto, I'd say people comparing it to a decade-old Flash storyline were even closer than they thought.

In "Hell To Pay," Wally made a deal with Neron to stop the reincarnated-without-their-souls Rogues from killing everyone in Keystone City, in exchange for his love for Linda Park.

"Don't even think it. You can't have Linda."

"I don't need Linda. But you do. You love her with a passion that burns through time and space. I would long have to travel both to fins a love equally as pure. It annoys me. I want you...to stop it."

It's not quite the same. It wasn't a retcon, no one's memories were erased, the stakes were higher...and it was a cliffhanger in the middle of a story, not the setup for a new status quo.

That was a brilliant idea ! Taking into consideration that Marvel already has Ultimate Spider-man with a young, unmarried and unmasked Peter Parker that lives with his aunt WHO (not counting Mr. Quesada) would want another series that are the same. They had two different takes on one character and didn't even fully explore the AmAzInG title's stories. I think that, among other moments, the best part of Civil War was Spiderman revealing his ID. Now it sucks to even think about that or how long it lasted. Congratulations are in order for this shit.

It's all the fault of that bullet powered by Editorial Fiat that hit Aunt May.

I haven't read Ultimate Spider #117 yet, so I don't know if Harry Osborn dies there. Maybe that was the plan all along (to kill one Harry here and resurrect the other) and I just cannot comprehend the genius behind One More Day.

Wow. Never seen anyone catch as much air while jumping a shark as Joey Q just did. Impressive!

"So whatever - the issue was just a case of needing to have SOMEthing to explain having a reboot, not really about doing a good comic book story."

Which, as I keep saying, is why they shouldn't have done it in the first place. They don't get a pass because they're not *trying* to make a comic worth reading. That's actually worse than trying and failing.

It does make sense for them to reprint only the last few pages of ASM Annual 21, though. If they reprinted the whole thing, then people would have seen that the story was about Peter growing as a person and making the truly noble sacrifice of letting go of his past tragedy to become the husband Mary Jane deserves, and then Joe's little house of cards here would have fallen down right out of the gate.

Finally: Since I'm betting that Aunt May no longer knows Peter is Spider-Man, Joe Quesada has now turned his nose up at, not one, not two, but three stories I really liked. So, y'know, fuck him.

I'm just sad. Just really, really sad. One man (Quesada) of whom I've been a fan. One destructive, out of touch, obsessive decision. And the whole facade collapses, for me at least. The Superboy punch was laughable, coming from a company for whom continuity was an irritation. This is hurtful, pathetic and unacceptable.

wait, so now Spiderman had the devil magically abort his daughter too? Wow.

The end of the issue was a friggin flashback! It was the point where peter could have gone after MJ but didn't and that now leads to them not being together in Brand New Day. Harry is NOT back!

I also want to know what MJ promised "Satan" for Peter's identity to be kept secret.

It's incredibly sad to know that peter will always wake up and feel alone.

@ Shaun.

Harry is back.

The end of the issue was a friggin flashback! It was the point where peter could have gone after MJ but didn’t and that now leads to them not being together in Brand New Day. Harry is NOT back!

It was not a flashback.

Harry is back.

Which, as I keep saying, is why they shouldn’t have done it in the first place. They don’t get a pass because they’re not *trying* to make a comic worth reading. That’s actually worse than trying and failing.

They are not getting a pass. It's a bad comic book. It's just a bad comic that is meant to set up a new status quo.

So yes, it is bad - but it doesn't mean that the new status quo will be bad.

And if the new status quo IS good, then we'll all forget this crummy storyline soon enough.

I would really like to know when Marvel is planning to do One More Reboot and correct this mess. I suspect only if this BND storyline and their weekly schedule will prove to be another mistake. Then Quesada (whom I thought was the best editor-in-chief Marvel could have) will apologize and at long last kill the immortal, indestructible Aunt May that knows too much stuff. I can imagine that future story - Peter regains his memories, builds a time travel machine and fixes everything. I bet I'll be sweeeeeet and everyone will love that .

So....we're back in the 70's? Personally, that's not a bad idea, it'd be interesting now to see what more Marvel can explore now that 20 years has gone.
They better reintroduce the black suit though, in some way or another =/

I didn't read this - largely because you couldn't pay me to (and I'm technically still boycotting the Spider books until they bring back Ben Reilly, although I wouldn't read them even if I wasn't), but everything I've heard in both the months leading up to it and since the issue came out indicates that this is probably going to blow up right in Quesada's face. The sheer amount of vehemence hurled at this storyline from pretty much every corner clearly indicates that Quesada is mandating a direction that nobody really wants to read. I won't be surprised if we see a noticeable decline in sales once Brand New Day comes out.

And reviving Harry Osborn? Did anyone really want to see Harry come back? Is there a H.O.A.T (Harry Osborn Advancement Team) out there somewhere I don't know about? It seems like the book isn't just negating the marriage, but actually dialing the book back to 1980. I really don't see how anyone would think this is the best direction for the book to go (especially when it's just resetting to the same basic status quo that is Ultimate Spidey's raison d'etre).

Is it just me or did Q make Peter into the stereotypical comic book geek? He went from having a relationship with a real, non-inflatable woman to living in an older relative's basement and hanging with his high school friends. The new Peter makes Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons look like James Bond.

wait, so now Spiderman had the devil magically abort his daughter too? Wow.

Shit. All these years, I've wanted to see a Spider-Man/Hellblazer teamup, and I could never think of the right story for them. And then this comes along.

Thanks for the missed opportunity, Marvel!!!

Maybe they're purposely trying to negate everything that's unique about Ultimate Spider-Man, so we don't miss the Ultimate line when it dies two years from now thanks to Jeph Loeb's magic touch.

the question is how does this affect the rest of the marvel universe..new avengers, etc...does everybody else forget everything that happens..is he still an avenger? did civil war never happen. WTF!!???!

Y'know, great stories can be told with a single Peter, an alive Aunt May, and Harry Osborn hanging around. Oh wait, those stories were already told 35+ years ago!!! Let it go, Joey Q., this is just sad on your part! What, no Gwen Stacy back from the dead? We already have 3 titles featuring a single Spidey, we didn't need another one, especially a Spidey "divorced by Satan."

[...] Comics Should Be Good! » Amazing Spider-Man #545 Kinda Review While it’s in-character that Peter Parker is self-sacrificing to the point of absurdity, it’s equally out of character for him to literally strike a deal with the devil. Bah. (tags: comics comicbooks marvel spiderman) [...]

Andrew raises an interesting question.

Why NOT bring Gwen back too?

I'm seriously asking. Harry's back, Norman's back and presumably doesn't know Peter's identity, the marriage is gone...is there any reason NOT to bring Gwen back as well?

YES THEY SHOULD TOTALLY BRING BACK GWEN STACY

AND JEAN DEWOLFF TOO

AND THE ORIGINAL TARANTULA WHO HAD THE BOOTS WITH SPIKES ON THEM

AND MAYBE ONE OR TWO OF THE DEAD HOBGOBLINS

"and hanging with his high school friends."

To be fair, he didn't meet Harry until college.

Isn't Joe Q the same man whose magnum opus involved turning the blind man Matt Murdock saved into a child molester? Did people expect him to actually turn out something decent storywise?

So how long do we have to wait to find out if sales
bear out this decision to change the stat quo?

So, JMS´s 7(?)years of work (good or bad, im not judging) were just thrown in the toillet??

JMS must be really, REALLY happy with JQ.

I i were in his shoes, i´d quit Marvel...

This was obviously the most stupid movie Marvel has ever made if this is the new status-quo. If so, I'm gone, I've been through the single Peter years. Enough is enough.

"So, JMS´s 7(?)years of work (good or bad, im not judging) were just thrown in the toillet??"

Feels more like the last 36-37 years were just dumped

Quesada seems pretty adamant about the belief that no good Spidey stories were made after The Ditko to Romita reign of the 60s. I love those books but they weren't the ones I grew up with. Outside of being lucky enough to catch a random tpb at the library as a kid, I didn't even get to dive into those issues fully until a few years back when I was at college.

Can't get mad though, We've got about 40 promised issues of a single Spidey title supposedly coming this new year. Let's see how much can change by the end of 2008 and hope we aren't looking back fondly at One More Day in comparison to those future stories.

So if Peter & MJ's love is "the rarest love of all. Pure, unconditional..." wouldn't that seem to suggest that they'll just fall in love all over again? I haven't read the issue so I don't know if this was addressed.

It's always irked me that Joey Q rants on and on about how fans don't want a married Spidey, and that it makes him boring. Where's the campaign to erase the Reed & Sue Richards marriage? They've been together a lot longer than Pete & MJ.

And how about Wally West? Fans still seem to enjoy him as a character, even though he's married (and now has kids as well).

It seems that there's a train of thought that the core concept of Spidey/Pete is "the lovable loser who keeps trying. And, oh yeah, he shouldn't be with a supermodel. Average guys don't get supermodels". Sorry, but even without powers, Peter Parker isn't an average guy. He's very intelligent, highly principled, brave and goes out of his way to help people even when it costs him dearly. Someone that decent and responsible isn't going to be alone for very long.

"So if Peter & MJ’s love is “the rarest love of all. Pure, unconditional…” wouldn’t that seem to suggest that they’ll just fall in love all over again? I haven’t read the issue so I don’t know if this was addressed."

It was, pretty directly. Many people don't know how to read.
And don't forget, apparently the story is bad. I don't know why because no one has actually said anything besides "we all know how bad it is".

What's so wrong about Peter and MJ just getting a divorce?

sounds like i was the only one who kind of liked this "reboot." i was never a fan of pete's identity being known to the world. i like that one idea that the end of this comic was a flash back and harry is not alive. if not i am sure marvel has a good idea about where this story is going and i will always continue to buy amazing spider-man!

This is the kind of thing that makes me stop buying Spiderman for a LOOONNNGGGG time.

Ugh.

As for Spidey living with Aunt May, odds are, May needs Peter to support her, hence them living together. That’s not so odd, is it?

Not really, no (although one could ask what exactly May's been doing to support herself up to now); but the context makes it look like it. The stigma of 'still living at home with the parents' isn't about it being a cushy financial arrangement so much as a cushy way of avoiding adult responsibility. That's largely the way it's being presented here - that Peter just can't get past the apron strings.

They do attempt to explain why Peter would be willing to trade all of that for May, and it is because May died because...of Peter, so that guilt would destroy him - and he would be no good to MJ anyways, because he would be too wracked with guilt.

[sigh] Yeah. Because heaven forfend Peter Parker should ever have to cope with his omnipresent tragedies in a capable, mature, dare I say even philosophical manner, instead of wallowing in maximum angst. Right here you've got a brilliant example of a story possibility involving a married Spidey, but no...he's lots more fun when he's just being helplessly dumped on, right, TPTB?

I give up on the whole mess. I like the contrast between flawed and hero as much as anyone, but there have to be limits somewhere.

After thinking about it for a bit, I've figured out what the biggest problem is with Quesada's run as EiC. He isn't looking ahead at what's to come or thinking about future directions to take the Marvel universe, he's looking at the past and how to rewind back to the Silver Age.

Spider-Man should still be a dateless loser who lives with his aunt, so let's have the devil erase his marriage. The heroes should fight each other when they meet, not get along, so let's have half of them register with the government and the other half not. Mutants should be an insignificant minority, not a realistic one, so let's depower all of the ones that aren't big moneymakers. It's all about resetting the Marvel universe to exactly the way Quesada liked it instead of any sort of forward progression.

Just bad. This smacks of Shooters determination with remaking all the Marvel characters so they would be "his". There is a definite problem with an EIC becoming this obsessed with one aspect of a character. At least having PP and MJ get married, and seperated, etc shows some growth in the characters. Now we'll have what? A bunch of 30-somethings acting like horny teenagers?
Dump Joe Q!

The thing is, I don't mind Peter Parker being back to sort of his classic self. I don't even mind using Amazing for that title. Afterall why not let the classic title feature the classic character.

BUT NOT THIS WAY. (and not with Jackpot. I'm not sure which is more dumb, that character or OMD.)

..and not doing so with no regard for the simple fact that the marriage has been around long enough to have at least what 2,3 generations of readers for whom the marriage is part and parcel? There's many ways you could have achived this same goal without resorting to this bullshit that takes a whiz not only on those fans but on the character as a whole. Editors warm themselves with this gleefull notion that nothing they do can cause longterm damage to a character. Even if that's true that doesn't mean the character and his storyworld cannot be stained by stupid decision making.

For one, if you can afford to publish 4 Spider-Man books a month then at least one of them can still have Peter and MJ married.

Two, if it's a reboot call it a damn reboot. End the previous continuity and that way you're at least respecting people who came in with the marriage enough to give them closure. Maybe even set up some thing that if fans wanted would lead comfortably into Spider-Girl.

Three, Marvel could do what the All-Star line should have been which is books that feature accessible iconic versions of the characters for young and old alike rather than vanity projects for big name and often over rated creators. Not to name any names but "goddamn."

Well, at least Marvel has furthered the whole "it happened in EUROPE!" or "he wasn't dead, he was in EUROPE!" angle that worked with Norman Osborne and Gwen Stacy's kids. In Spider-Man's world, Superboy doesn't need to punch a wall -- just hop a plane to this magical, far-off place called "Europe" and YOU TOO can live again and have super-powered children!

Its funny, every single non-comics reading person I've told about this story has reacted in the same way. "But... but Spiderman loves Mary Jane" followed by "comics are so stupid, I'm glad I don't read them". Way to promote the medium Marvel, you mongrel idiots.

M Bloom said:

"After thinking about it for a bit, I’ve figured out what the biggest problem is with Quesada’s run as EiC. He isn’t looking ahead at what’s to come or thinking about future directions to take the Marvel universe, he’s looking at the past and how to rewind back to the Silver Age."

This is, of course, an insult to the Silver Age, which was all about creativity, wild new ideas, fresh characters and inspiration, and doing things that had never been tried before.

I can understand long time readers being annoyed but basically Spider-Man isn't for you. If you've been reading it for 20 years then, yes, I'm afraid it IS time to give it up. Let it go to the new young fans discovering the character. It's who Spidey is for.

Lew

Let it go to the new young fans discovering the character. It’s who Spidey is for.

Would these be the young fans who discover Peter and MJ as a model of true love in the movies and are baffled by Satan-divorce and Jackpot in the comics, or the new readers who couldn't give a hang about American superhero comics and read manga digests instead?

Spot on, Lew!

Spot on, Omar!

I thought that basically that was the reason behind creating new imprints like Ultimate line or Marvel Age. But selling similar stuff is not enough.... IT has to be identical. You do not choose what you want to read. Quesada does.
It's a shame that Spidey didn't ask the devil to talk One More time with his Aunt before agreeing. She would have said to him that he should let her go (to be reunited with Uncle Ben) and have a nice life. That would spare us this awkward situation and many posts on the net. AND readers would have new adventures of Spiderman, MJ and their baby in Europe !!! wooooohooooo

"You love her with a passion that burns through time and space. I would long have to travel both to find a love equally as pure. It annoys me. I want you…to stop it."

This cracked me up . That's a much better reason for erasing a love than achieving some dubitable victory over [We-Don't-Call-Him-God]!

As for the comic book itself, well, whatever. It seems utterly stupid now, but maybe they actually have some sort of a plan. But even if they don't - from my experience superhero books are good when good writers write them and bad when bad writers write them. Simple as that. Dan Slott is a good writer so I would be cautiously optimistic.

Still I hope they haven't dumped the past completely and will find some way to reconcile the new status quo with the old one. A complete reboot would be kind of pointless, especially with Ultimate Spiderman around.

You know what'd be a good twist? If at the end they showed Mephisto coming home after a long day's evil and inside he's greeted by Spiderman and Mary Jane's marriage. The loving couple greet him and... he smiles. That's all he wanted their marriage for. Not to piss off God or be ruin happiness, he just wanted to have it around the house to cheer him up. Like a puppy or a bonsai plant.

"take my wife, please."

They actually got me to quit reading spider-man. I'm amazed. All that talk about power and responsibility, facing your troubles like a man, living and honoring the memory of your dead uncle. When chips were truly down, when your back is against the wall, when you come face to face with the ultimate evil, what does my hero say?

"anything you want."

I'm seriously disgusted. It's not just the fact that he damned himself, Peter Parker asked the same of the love of his life. AND, MJ made a second deal that put her soul on the line. He CONVINCED his love to throw it all away and possibly worse.

I'm sure Quesada would say, "well, what would you do if someone you loved was dying?" I watched my mother die in a coma thanks. And I'm not going to sell my soul to magically make everything OK, so that I'm living in her basement.

peter parker failed in a way you don't come back from. He didn't have to sell his soul, he handed it over instead of being a man.

the best thing about comics is that if you really love the peter-MJ marriage, you can go back and read whatever issues you want, and not read the new stuff.
the best thing about the internet i that it will tell us when they get back together and we can start reading the new issues again!
God bless us, everyone!

And don’t forget, apparently the story is bad. I don’t know why because no one has actually said anything besides “we all know how bad it is”.

Well, right off the bat, I do note that it is not a full review.

Beyond that, the reason it is bad is implicit in the description of the issue - it was all simply a retcon. There wasn't really a story in the issue - it was just an issue-long retcon. Setting the guidelines, etc.

There was no plot, there was no real characterization, it was just getting the retcon across. And that is a bad comic book.

Doesn't mean Brand New Day will be bad comics, though!

I want to hold out for the first issue of Brand New Day. If it starts to set something up that is interesting then I might read it in graphic novel format.

I quit reading spiderman years ago. I started at the beginning of the clone saga and was the only one on the planet who loved that storyline I followed SM all the way through The Gathering of Five and then stopped right before JM Deutchebag took over and systematically destroyed everything I loved about the character. I picked up stories here and there and picked up OMD just to see how they would end the marriage. But, through all of this, I feel like JoeQ and Marvel have tried different ways of ending the marriage. JMS did it early with the stalker and then with MJ leaving pete. I had to get the series when she came back to him. And I will hopefully in 10 or so years get the series when she comes back again.

I agree with Elijah Fly. Peter failed so miserably at the end of OMD but I think so did MJ. If, in fact, his identity is completely forgotten then that atleast takes care of Civil War. If Harry is back, he is the only character (other than Gwen) that I never want to see return. His story was complete and doesn't need a redo. It was perfect the way it was. As for peter, Marvel has taken so much away from him that I think it's time he redeems himself.

And seriously KILL aunt may in issue #600.

Good luck trying to explain this to a non-fan:

"Didn't I read in the paper that Spider-Man unmasked?"
"Yes, but..."
"And isn't he married to Mary Jane? Didn't that happen in the 70's?"
"OK. Spider-Man made a deal with the devil to erase his marriage from history after a sniper shot Aunt May. She was dying, so he exchanged his marriage for his Aunt, so now noone knows that he's Spider-Man."

"Huh?"

And ya gotta love the fact that this comic came out on Stan Lee's birthday.

A story in which Spider-Man loses, is not able to figure a way out of the predicament, and isn't able to fight back. Yeah, that's what I wanna read in my superhero comic books.

This issue sucked!! I cant believe they are erasing years of issues. ARGH!! You know in a year, it will go back to normal again. Anything for a buck. You know what I miss? I miss the artwork from the 70's, early 80's when peterparker looked real. Not this type of artwork.

@ Shaun

JMS didn't write Amazing Spider-Man until issue #33 of volume 2. That was after the stalker, and after the break-up.

I was previously excited about Brand New Day, but now I have reservations. This is a terrible, dreadful status quo the new writing collective has inherited. They can do whatever they like to try and make it fun and adventuresome-- it's still going to be in the back of everyone's mind that, in terms of plot, the fun came at the expense of Peter Parker cutting a monstrously inexcusable deal with the devil.

It would be one thing if this had any chance of bringing in new readers, but I'd be uncomfortable giving a child anything but a Marvel Adventures Spider-Man book at this point. Brand New Day is already locked in to only appealing to the traditional comics audience.

The One More Day storyline clearly expresses, if unintentionally, that it's okay to force other people to ruin their lives in order to get what you personally want. No matter how fun Brand New Day is, since it's predicated on One More Day, you eventually have to explain the latter for the sake of the former.

This is how the average person understands the concept of "continuity" when events in a fictional work are presented in sequence. It is especially the way children understand "continuity". I'm not explaining why selling things to the Devil and offending God for your own selfish needs is okay to any damn kid I'm related to, let alone any theoretical children of my own. They're better off not reading about Spider-Man.

What did MJ whisper to Mephisto?

"What did MJ whisper to Mephisto?"

- Please, don't let them transform me in Jackpot. It´s a silly idea.

MJ: I'll always remember the past few days with you...don't part mad, tell him the truth? Okay?

Mephisto: Okay.

MJ: Hey, handsome, how about I let you wipe out my ever even knowing Peter so we can get together?

Mephisto: Woo hoo!

Any mention of Amazing 545 automatically changes the title of this site to "Comics Can't Get Any Worse."

I just have to say that is the craziest thing I've ever seen in my 30+ years of reading comics. The biggest issue I have is Joe's stated reason for this. He wants to make the book accessible to future generations at the expense of continuity. He wants to turn the comics that we have been reading for years into a superhero Archie comic. Which I think leads into the biggest question you have to ask when doing a serialized work with no set end. You can have Progress or Evolution. With progress, you have continuity. What happened in the past affects the future. Think Marvel Comics before Joe. With evolution nothing in the past is recalled within the story but small little changes can be picked up over time. A good example would be South Park. For the first 5 years the character of Kenny was killed in each episode. At the start of the next one he would be back with no mention. Eventually the creators tired of this and stopped. Around the same time (if I remember correctly) several new characters were silently added, like Butters and Timmy. The show evolved many similar things over its 10 years without the characters aging (much). Either one of these ideas will work for Marvel. With progress they could slowly allow their characters to age and let a new generation of characters take over. With evolution the core characters never change, but you would have to go back to done in ones (or small arcs in general) with little mention of things from the past. They are currently doing this in the Marvel Adventures line of comics. The one thing you can't do, successfully, is try to have these both, kind of sort of. Which is what we have had to deal with over the years. For a book with continuity to work you must be prepared to follow the short term decisions to their logical conclusions. 'nuff said

Of course, the really scary thing here will be seeing how Dan Didio plans to top this one.

I advise lots of running away and screaming.

Considering Dan Slott's only real notable Spider-Man contribution was the (admitting fun) pastiche of old Spider-Man, it does make sense that he's the one kicking off the 'revitalised' ASM, but why would I want to read a winking Spider-Man story with Steve McNiven's stiff, wax-like humans but plenty of detailed bricks art, done "just like old days, but MODERN!" when I can read Stan/Steve/Johnny's groundbreaking stuff that's played as straight fun and beautiful storytelling?

"I’m technically still boycotting the Spider books until they bring back Ben Reilly"

Whoa.

Anyway, I'm totally with Elijah Fly. Today's creators (okay, EDITORS) don't have the first fucking clue about what adult responsibility really is.

"Whoa."

I liked Ben. He was a great character and they could have found a way to write him out of the book and set up something else for him to do instead of taking the easy way out and killing him. After that happened I vowed to never buy another Spider-Man comic until Ben was brought back to life. Granted, it's become apparent in recent years that there's nothing I consider worth reading in Spider-Man anyways, so it's less of a boycott now and more of a total lack of interest.

But if Ben Reilly came back for good in an heroic capacity, you bet I'd be there at my LCS with $2.99 in hand.

One of the most irritating things about this reboot is that it's got bait-and-switch written all over it. This is something I'd begun to notice about quite a few books from DC Comics, for example, the All-New Atom being one of them, that use possibly high-profile writers as a drawing card. In other words, they're hoping that Dan Slott, whom some may have considered a talented writer, will be able to contain some of the damage that's likely to result from Quesada's forced reboot. But if they're going to wreck all the things that worked for Spidey all these years, that's why I for one can't embrace his upcoming work.

Quesada's whole argument about new readers not being able to identify with a married Spider-Man lacks logic because being able to get married would have to be something that a lot of readers would like to do! In other words, Spidey's marrying was something that was meant to be inspiring and admirable. How Quesada can't understand that is beyond me.

I haven't bought any newer stuff from Marvel for almost four years now, and I've got no intention of being misled by what's to follow on the heels of this travesty either. Because if they're going to destroy everything that made Spider-Man work, then any "fun" that could come in the weekly format being launched is invalidated and illegitimate. It's similar in some ways to how DC screwed over Ray Palmer and Jean Loring before launching the All-New Atom; that's one of the reasons why I won't buy it even in trades. Because if they're going to disgrace classic characters, showing total disregard for the writers who went to such pains to create them in the first place (i.e. Gardner Fox), then offering up ostensibly fun stories afterwards is simply not credible, and is practically insulting.

"Pure, unconditional and made holy in the eyes of he who I hate most."

Wait, if his love for Mary Jane is purer and less conditional than his love for Aunt May, then why did he choose Aunt May over her?

I mean, "bringing my aunt back to life" seems like a condition to me.

It would be a great twist if she were bed-ridden and comatose for the rest of the series, but NEVER died.

I get having the illusion of change in a comic, as opposed to constant change, but now all illusion is gone.
Anything that happens in the book can be wiped out - you now know he won't ever marry MJ or anyone else, and besides, who cares - we've already seen it.
This is Dallas all over again, and it'll play out the same.
There will be an initial sales spike, and then it'll drop back down to normal - was it really worth it?

This is the worst.

"It would be a great twist if she were bed-ridden and comatose for the rest of the series, but NEVER died."

If only. I mean, it sure seems like Pete got the better end of the deal. He gets exactly what he asked for with no loopholes? Sounds like Mephisto is a pretty shitty Satan, to be honest.

The thing that bugs me about this arc is that Aunt May is little more than a Maguffin. It's about her, but it's not. Honestly, the person who suggested that she should have been supernaturally consulted has it right on the money. If this whole deal is about her and they're dealing with someone who can apparently change the world on a whim, I would think Peter might have thought it prudent to get a little pow-wow going. But naturally, that wouldn't have made sense because Aunt May is actually intelligent and would have told Peter and Mary Jane (and Quesada) what ridiculous idiots they're being, what a wonderful life she's led, how it's not Peter's fault, etc. I'm almost positive that Sensational dealt with this right before OMD butted in.

-M

Wow!Joey Q. just does not want me to buy spider-man comics.I haven't bought any new spidey comic(besides marvel age,those are kida cool) since JMS started his terrible run and now this.Well,I guess I'll stick to the collections of cool spidey stories (married and unmarried).

The issue's ending is perplexing. After first reading, I assumed it was set in the past (younger looking Pete still living with aunt, riding bike, Harry alive) at the point where the timeline diverged.

But here, folks seem to think this is the new status quo.

If that's the case ... seriously, how much continuity did they just clusterfuck in one fell swoop? Why not just read Ultimate Spider-Man, seriously?

Overall, OMD had all the classic hallmarks of a very bad fanfic idea ... unfortunately, it was Joe Quesada's idea and he was in the position to make it reality.

About a year or so ago I had a desire to start reading Amazing Spider-man, but was held back by the constant crossover tie-ins. I just assumed that I would start picking it up later when good old fashioned heroic Spider-man stories started again. But now, I really don't care. Quesada's desire to 1984 Peter Parker's entire life is so disappointing that I have zero interest in picking up the title now. Both companies have been so obsessed with epic crossovers lately that I haven't been buying anything from either one. Poorly played Mr. Quesada. Poorly played indeed.

What I'm afraid of is that this reboot won't affect the other titles, which means that Spider-Man will have his own continuity that will be contradicted every single time he crosses over into another title.

I suppose that this could be solved by simply not crossing him over. Turn him into his own pocket-universe like DC did to Batman for a little while in the 90s.

I'm also wondering where the influx of readers is supposed to come from? The whole idea of doing something controvertial that may cost readers is that it is assumed that the lost readers will be replaced by people who weren't reading the title but may be intrigued by the new direction.

As has been mentioned, this is a little too far out in left field to attract new readers.

Hulk turns grey? Because he experimented on himself and radically changed his body chemistry. Oh, well I (generic person, not necessarilly me) always thought he was too strong and predictable. This could be interesting, I'll give it a try.

Captain America loses his name and costume? Well, I always thought he was kinda stuck up and silly. But, if this brings humility to the character it could be interesting. I'll give it a try.

Ben Riley, the spider clone? There's someone on this forum who thought it was interesting and gave it a try.

Jim Rhodes takes the Iron Man armour? That's what actually got me interested in the character.

Superman dies? Batman's back is broken? Earthquake in Gotham? Hawkeye leading the Thunderbolts? Doom as a hero in the year 2099? All of those, I could see the potential and interest that would get someone who maybe doesn't even read comic books at all interested.

But, Spider-Man trades his marriage and years of his life to save his Aunt May and now it is unclear what past stories you may or may not know about him are true or erased, and we're going back to the status quo of the late 70s early 80s, so if you loved them back before you were alive you might love them now -- and don't pick up any TPBs or it might confuse you.

I don't see that as a great selling point to get new readers.

Theno

Theno - I would agree with your post except for the War Machine thing.

This is the same impetus as "let's put Thor in a ponytail and earring" and "we need a new Iron Man -- how 'bout the black guy?"

The editors alternate between continuity-wanking and continuity-panic; either one can make for good stories (Morrison is the former, and 2099 is the latter), either one can make for bad stories (latter-day Claremont, the Death of Superman). Going too far in either extreme rarely works.

The odd thing about this movie is that it seems like continuity-panic, but I would argue that it is actually Quesada wanking in his own way... he's just wanking for the continuity *he* grew up on. Which is why this is doomed to fail; continuity-panic works when they come up with a good way to remove all the excess baggage which has built up over the year without changing what makes the thing work; this seems too much like Sentry, where everything that we've read should be affected by it.

"And seriously KILL aunt may in issue #600."

That would continue a long tradition on the series. Y'see, Aunt May "died" for the first time at issue #200 or thereabouts and the second time at issue #400. It would be fair for she to "die" again at #600.

Of course, she would get better quickly, after all she is an immortal!

Best,
Hunter (Pedro Bouça)

I was faintly pleased to see this thing booted in the head on Newsarama:

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=141416

Makes a change from the usual GO, WEB GO! cheerleader antics they have there.

The answer is simple. The unmasking of Spider-man made a great story, but it was going to make future issues very difficult. This way they can unmask Spider-man in the continuity of the story line and then revert back to his secret identity. Although this is weird I think that it will make interesting future stories. Hopefully it isn't going to be another Ultimate way of story telling by rehashing Spider-mans past for stories...wait and see.

I was faintly pleased to see this thing booted in the head on Newsarama:

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=141416

Makes a change from the usual GO, WEB GO! cheerleader antics they have there.

Newsarama people are only cheerleaders for DC. Hating on Marvel is par for the course over there.

yeah they screwed the pooch on this one.

Totally out of character move by parker that is obviously just Quesada desperately trying to make everything the way he wants it. It doesn't matter if it makes any sense little Joey just wants to get back in the news. In fact if it were a slower news period then I am sure someone would have run the story. which is all his ego wanted.

Some one will fix it down line. Maybe Mephisto was a skrull and now Pete is in a holodeck on the enterprise which has been taken over by skrulls and none of this is really happening at all. Currently there is a Spider Skrull in New York and no one knows it.

or maybe the Scarlett Witch will whisper "continuity snafu" and everything will reset again.

you know for me the whole point i got into comics was because of spiderman and today when i read asm 545 i was pissed then i thought maybe it was one of those things but damn man just get rid of aunt may we dont need her gosh JQ ruined my day thanks a lot JQ i mean i got into comics this year and i think i will never buy a comic book because of you

- Aunt May dies (Amazing 400)
- No, the Green Goblin kidnapped her.
- They reveal the Spider-man we know is a clone
- No he isn't. The Green Goblin was playing a joke.
- Mary-Jane gets pregnant.
- The baby is stillborn then forgotten.
- Mary-Jane dies.
- No she was kidnapped then found.
- Norman Osborn becomes a Lex Luthor-esque recurring character and owner of the Daily Bugle.
- Goes nuts and is hauled off.
- Spider-man may have Illigitamate children.
- Spidey dies and comes back with Wolverine like talons which he quickly forgets he has.

I would love to see a writer who doesn't want to write some tremendous event that takes Spider-man in a new direction or redefines what the character is all about.

What I actually want to see is just a silly yarn were perhaps one of Spidey's foes has a new plot and Spidey foils it.

It could be a mystery, adventure, romance, or comedy story as opposed to an overly melodramatic soap opera.

With great powers comes great responsability.

And then he makes a deal with the DEVIL.

Way to go, Joe Q!

I told my 7 year old that Peter & MJ made a deal with a demon to make them to never have been married and now they won't have the daughter they would have had to save Aunt May's life. My little guy said "Wow daddy?! Aunt May's really old, so it's time for her to die and a child seems to be a better idea." Go figure!

I've read the storyline 3 times now and as a 30 year reader (since 5 years old) this has hit hard. MJ and Peter have always been connected in some way for the majority of Spider-man's existance. I'm gald to see they are still acquaintances. Everythings so crazy that I'm glad it's going to once a week distribution, so I can see where things are going. It should be fun. Enjoy true believers!

I say let the Ghost Rider kill Mephisto and revert that shit.

Now I know why they wrote in Issue 2 from One More Day:
If you want to read only one comic book in this century let it be this one!!!!
Well yes if I only read one this century I wouldn't like to find mephisto in it let alone that Deal.
So yes part two was the last one that I could at least somehow accept.

This is just further proof Joe's reign is coming to an end. He knows nothing beyond shock tactics. I supect this will be retconned in two years much like the new coustume, the organic powers, the unmasking, and Ben Reily were.

This is "Chapter One" all over again. Creative bankruptcy. NEVER have a f*cking ARTIST edit your creative deparment. All you'll get is an empty canvas.

I respect Dan as a writer, but I wont support "Brand New Day". Tom Defalco's Spider-Girl, now more than ever, is officially the TRUE custodian of an organic, intelligent, and barely corrupt Marvel Universe.

So long 616. Your fractured, petty "No More Mutants" reality-warping bollocks has finally destroyed your most iconic character and a marraige that predates, PREDATES, Lois Lane and Superman's marraige.

Marvel were once innovators, now there just imitators.

...And imitating stuff DC is imitating from 1987 is just self-indulgently sad.

Lets call for a boycott on all Spiderman title... or even worst, all marvel titles to send a message to Marvel and JoeQ.

Money Speaks

Does anyone remember the reasons behind why MJ and Spidey married in the first place?

The editorial decision did not come from the main comics publishing Marvel Bullpen. MJ and Spidey in 1986 was not a real item IIRC.

The editorial decision came from STAN LEE himself in his daily Spider-man newspaper comic. HE was the one that made the decision to marry them. If anyone had the right to marry them off - HE was THE MAN TO DO IT. The Marvel Bullpen at that time decided to take advantage of the publicity in turn had MJ marry Spidey in the monthly comics.

So what is Stan Lee's take on this?

MJ and Spidey is still married in the daily newspaper strips. And I daresay, with a printed circulation internationally of several million (newspaper strips readership are hard to guess at) - thats at the very least x100 (correct me if I am wrong) the readership of the monthly books - the MARRIED Spidey is the default Spidey to the common people (Movies + Newspaper strip) >>>>>>> comics.

Jeez why did it have to be Mephisto? To me, Peter Parker was a clever guy who always found a way to do the "right thing", making a deal with Mephisto is the total polar opposite of clever and doing the "right thing". C'mon - Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlets (no matter how illogical) wiping reality and etc. will make more sense than this!

The thing that bugs me about this arc is that Aunt May is little more than a Maguffin. It’s about her, but it’s not. Honestly, the person who suggested that she should have been supernaturally consulted has it right on the money. If this whole deal is about her and they’re dealing with someone who can apparently change the world on a whim, I would think Peter might have thought it prudent to get a little pow-wow going.

She was, in fact, via Madame Web. She begged them not to do it.

I think the point they tried to achieve was "oh no it´s uncle ben all over again". Aunt May is dying and it´s all Peter´s fault, because he unmasked. So he´s gotta fix it.

But, IMHO, they failed.

I agree with who said Joe Q is all about shock value. Everything he did at Marvel was a "let´s do what no one has done before":

- unmask Spider-Man

- Wolverine´s origin

- bring Bucky back

- unmask all the heros (Daredevil, Iron Man, Captain America)

- let the Hulk smash everything and everyone

- disassemble the Avengers

...you forgot "erase memory of retcon punch".

"There was no plot, there was no real characterization, it was just getting the retcon across. And that is a bad comic book.

Doesn’t mean Brand New Day will be bad comics, though! "
=====
Yes, it does.

Spider-Man: BTK will really suck.

T. said:

"Newsarama people are only cheerleaders for DC. Hating on Marvel is par for the course over there."
=====

I don't know what you have been reading, but Newsarama is highly pro-Marvel. Shoot, even one of their former owners worked for Marvel.

So can I write Marvel now and ask for a refund on all the Spidey comics they published over the past 20 years?
If they're gonna take back the stories, I'd like to take back the money.

The worst thing about all that is the thing with the civil war. I mean what happened actually. Did Spidey do everithing except unmasking or did everything change?

When I told a friend of mine about the story he said: OMG but Civil War. That changes everything, maybe even the new Captain America is the old one.

MJ's whisper: "********** REMEMBER EVERYTHING" the first line is indistinct to my eyes...but the last 2 lines read Remember Everything...use a good magnifying glass

This story actually made me say something I never thought i would: Bring back Jemas!!!

Seriously, JQ needs to go. Enough with turning the Marvel Universe into your own fan-wank. I HATED the JMS era (seriously, the Other? stingers? spider-totems? the whole Peter-has-bastard-children-but-no-wait-Gwen-had-them-with-Norman-Osbourn? organic powers which, if you think about it, means he should've been shooting his webbing out of his ass? Seriously, what a crappy era), but it did have it's fans and as Marvel points out, he did triple sales on the Spidey titles. So yeah, it makes sense to wipe away much of his work by rebooting the series to whenever. If JMS did so much for the Spider titles, how does jettisoning MJ mean new readers will be attracted? Oh wait, married characters scare away comic book readers because....er. Screw you, JQ.

And having Harry back is pointless; even without MJ, Peter still has tons of supporting characters, we don't need the additions of Brainy and Boobsie as potential love triangles/quadrangles.

Plus, it shows that the series of pointless. Why bother making a big fuss over the un-masking if they're just gonna redo it after a year or so?

JQ, please spend more time focusing on good comics instead of trying to get into Entertainment Weekly.