Comic Book Resources

Well, I, for one, am happy they put out an Essential Ant-Man, because I loved those old Giant-Man stories when I was a child. That said, I freely admit others' mileage will vary.

Oh, don't even tease about an Essential ROM. The lack of one, and even of ROM guest-starring issues of comics like Power Man & Iron First from their respective Essential volumes, is a real sore spot.

I mean, come on, pick up the licensing, people! Anyone? Anyone? Dark Horse?

I love the idea of an 800-page Essential Contest of Champions. That would be what, 50-odd pages of the miniseries and an equally essential 750 pages intentionally left blank?

Anyone else get a Pizza Hut ad after this post? The one for the $5 value pizza?

How meta...

I've got quite a few of those volumes but I'm finding it harder to justify at least the old material myself. Marvel has hit a bit of a rut where the new Essentials are mostly weak material from their glut in the 1970's and picking the wheat from the chafe in those can be difficult. For the same reason I don't buy a lot of DC's Showcase line; I like smiling along with it once and a while but I can't subside on a diet of it and locating the good material there is even harder (you've got Jonah Hex and... um... anyone want to fill in from there?).

On the other hand, I think recent turns toward large library bundles of more recent and high quality material is a good thing. I appreciate that DC is now only lacking Kamandi as the only major Kirby work for them not available in a fine hardbound volume (anyone complaining about the paper quality being "newsprint" needs to dig out a newstand comic from as recently as 1980 to see the difference in weight). I like the fact that Marvel has put some major runs into convenient volumes. I appreciate Dark Horse putting together nicer packages of Hellboy. I'm even replacing some of my paperback trades for these nice heavy duty hardcover ones that they're starting to churn out for bookstores (Sandman and Starman are at the top of the list for this replacement).

"Marvel has hit a bit of a rut where the new Essentials are mostly weak material from their glut in the 1970’s and picking the wheat from the chafe in those can be difficult."

First off, Marvel is drawing from a much smaller pool of material than DC, and they've already published most, if not all, of their good stuff. Marvel began the Essentials in 1997 and have about 115. DC start in 2005 and already has half that number -- and they've peppered their line with both marquee names (Superman, Batman, Justice League) and obscurer stuff (Haunted Tank), barely scratching the surface with their vast archive of material.

But my point is... why not? I see no big deal with DC and Marvel reprinting the hell out of their archives, even if it's the "silly" stuff. Everyone likes something different (I'm a huge fan of the 60s Titans even though I recognize how ridiculous it all is), there's material for everyone out there with no need to spend hundreds of dollars on back issues. Hey, and Ant-Man has to be "Essential" to somebody.

"(anyone complaining about the paper quality being “newsprint” needs to dig out a newstand comic from as recently as 1980 to see the difference in weight)"

Agreed. The selling point to me is that I want the material reproduced in a way that evokes the original. I think Kirby on super-glossy paper would not only "feel" wrong, but not even look as intended. That's why the heavily-inked Golden Age material -- think the early Kane/Finger Batman stories -- will never be printed as Showcase volumes. The material would be virtually unreadable.

So many fans spend so much time complaining about paper quality that I wonder if they throw their books across the room in their spare time since they're so concerned with durability. If anyone REALLY wants their collections published in the best possible condition they need to start buying as many Absolutes as they can. If the demand for highest-quality collections is there, trust me, they will publish them. Wait, can't afford that? Then please, stop complaining.

...and Ant-Man has to be “Essential” to somebody.

You rang?

I ADORE the Marvel Essentials that are 'lesser' material. The Son of Satan book, Tales of the Zombie, Godzilla.... I have been getting a huge charge out of seeing that stuff again. My favorite DC Showcases have been the B-listers, too... War That Time Forgot, Robin, Phantom Stranger, Jonah Hex. These are the stories that have never been reprinted. A lot of the time for me a big part of the fun has simply been seeing how it all turned out in runs I never was able to follow at the time, in those pre-comics-shop days.

My students are gluttons, too. Their preferred format is the manga digest, so they're used to seeing comics in big B/W chunks. Their favorite Essentials are Power Man and Godzilla, though if there's a Marvel movie out that's getting a lot of push on TV they'll look at that stuff too. But Essential Iron Man is really kind of a letdown for the kids that just want "more" after the movie. The obscure stuff interests them, though.

Hey, count me in as another who bought that Essential Ant-Man volume, and did so for two reasons -- one being that it was something that ran in a split book that I used to buy for pennies off of a market stall (this when i was growing up in the UK), and thus there's nostalgia involved; the second reason is that I got it cery cheap -- I think I bid a dollar on eBay, and it ended up in a box with several other books and thus combined postage. It's been fun dipping into it.

I'm very much an Essentials/Showcase Presents junkie, although I don't get everything, and I do seem to be leaning more towards Marvel than DC (which I did when I was a kid, too.) I have the six FF volumes, the eight Amazing Spider-Man, even the three Spectacular Spider-Man volumes (which reveal how rough things were getting, although things could get worse, as we all know.) I also picked up the three Defenders volumes because, well, Gerber, which explains the Man-Thing volume. One volume of Iron Man, all three Dr. Strange.... No Howard The Duck, as I have those in the original.

With DC I'm a bit more towards the fringe -- I have both Teen Titans volumes, one Flash, one Green Lantern, one Wonder Woman (sad to see they started with the fifties reboot), and I would hardly pass up the Supergirl book, or the first Legion volume. But I just picked up the Metamorpho volume, I have the Batman & The Outsiders collection (a chorus is heard going "Whyyy?"), Booster Gold (really the odd man out in this lot), Phantom Stranger, Elongated Man....

One of the things I like about these volumes is that I feel no guilt whatsoever about throwing one in my backpack and reading it in a cafe, or the park, or wherever. A couple of the more cheaply acquired titles have a slightly battered air to them as it is -- a couple are ex-libris. For me that's okay...mainline that nostalgia fix, baby, although they're too thick to roll up and stick in a back pocket (though this does belie the actual care I take of them; no drop-kicking the books into the yard during a rainstorm for me!)

I won't buy every volume that comes out, of course; amongst other things I don't have the room, and for another some things don't get my attention (no Superman, no Batman, no Hulk, no Captain America, and I'm steering clear of X-Men, far clear of Wolverine, so on and forth.) I just want to know where the hell Essential Nick Fury: Agent Of S.H.I.E.L.D. is...!

I think Kirby on super-glossy paper would not only “feel” wrong, but not even look as intended.

Agreed, I felt that way about Dark Horse's reprints of Kubert's Tarzan run.

There's always going to be something that's essential to someone. I'm this far away from downloading scans of Nth Man and making my own Essentials volume on Lulu.

Obviously comic book fans are a lot more charitable to older material.

But I don't think all of the old material is stuff that you need to be feeling charitable to appreciate.

For instance, most of Roy Thomas and Steve Englehart old Marvel stuff is very good. And they wrote a lot of stuff in a lot of titles. And that is not even mentioning Steve Gerber or Jim Starlin or Don McGregor or the early Claremont. I think there is a lot of post-Lee/Kirby Marvel stuff that is "worthy".

Yep, there is stuff that really is rubbish though. It's very subjetive, but I think Gerry Conway and Len Wein's Marvel work is mediocre at best.

Obviously comic book fans are a lot more charitable to older material.

Call it "more charitable" I guess. I call it "more likely to ignore."

I though the first Human Torch run was terrible. I absolutely loathe the Kannigher/Andru Wonder Woman, an' think it's a waste of both men's considerable talents. While there's a big contingent of us who really admire the Dick Sprang era Batman, I've never read the later stuff that ended up in the Showcase volumes, and I very rarely hear it discussed. Hoppy the Marvel Bunny went way downhill after he got demoted to Magic Bunny.

The good stuff gets championed, but there doesn't seem to be much point in freaking out about bad comics made by people who are long dead or in their eighties.

"For instance, most of Roy Thomas and Steve Englehart old Marvel stuff is very good. And they wrote a lot of stuff in a lot of titles. And that is not even mentioning Steve Gerber or Jim Starlin or Don McGregor or the early Claremont. I think there is a lot of post-Lee/Kirby Marvel stuff that is “worthy”."

Oh there definitely is and perhaps its most annoying when an Essential volume contains perhaps 1/3 material worth checking out and 2/3's "We've got to get something on the newsstand!" garbage. Monster of Frankenstein is a great example of this phenomena. I'll still buy an essential if I'm getting that much material that I want but I wouldn't touch one for, say, a one or two issue run by a creator. I'm going to have to think hard before buying Defenders Volume 4 when it gets released...

For the person looking for Essential Nick Fury Agent of SHIELD there is a nice full color trade of all of Steranko's work available for $20. Per page it winds up being twice as expensive as an Essential but it's color and has the good stuff. I'm holding out for a hard cover edition of it since at the rate those are getting done Marvel has to do sometime.

And I'm still unclear on where the great material in the Showcase line is. Very little in that line rises above level of light historical interest and silver age fun (something which has its place). I'm willing to give the Phantom Stranger a chance and Jonah Hex is an obvious one (wasn't there some kind of legal problem which caused the volume to be split there and is holding up later volumes?). If that Suicide Squad volume would ever get released it would be an obvious one...

Enemy Ace is still, IMO, the best thing that's ever come out of DC Comics.

Someday, someday I'll get around to explaining Silver Age DC superhero comics and how they work. It really isn't obvious to folks used to the modern, more filmic and soap-opera based modes of storytelling.

Heck, I don't blame the Essentials and Showcases for turning me off modern comics, I credit it. Much of the Silver and Bronze Age material I'm reading, I'm reading for the first time, and I continue to be amazed at the craft those older guys had. Even the goofiness of the material comes not from a lack of talent, but the simple fact that these comics were aimed at kids and didn't apologize for it.

So much of the material back then was fresh, original, and inventive in a way that even guys like Grant Morrison are just aping now. Modern comics writers are just recycling the back-catalog of ideas that Lee, Kirby, Ditko, Kanigher, Haney, Thomas, Broome, Fox, et cetera were coming up with fresh every month. Realizing that I'm reading non-stop regurgitations of the Silver Age has been what's turned me off modern superhero comics, not a general lack of appreciation for the medium. If I want Silver Age comics, they're publishing 1500 pages a month of it (sometimes 2000), and that's all I need.

Am I the only one who would want a "You Will Believe in Ghosts" Showcase edition?

Yes, I probably am.

I'd love to know more about this Hex legal issue...but being married to a lawyer is the reason for that.

Tom, that was probably the DC battle with the Winters brothers over the Lansdale-written Vertigo series, where they sued over being caricatured for "Riders Of The Worm." That shouldn't affect the Showcase Presents volumes, which have their own issues in not consisting entirely of Jonah Hex stories. I wonder if there'll be a future volume or two with the Hex series following on from the original run?

I think DC should put out a couple of volumes of the romance comics myself. and maybe a couple of their various Archie knock-offs like Life With Scooter. Alas, we'll likely not see volumes for the Bob Hope and Jerry Lewis comics....

The ultimate Showcase Presents would of course be DC Showcase Presents DC Showcase.

John Seavey -- no kidding about the places some of those silver age and golden age writers went. I've just been looking at some of the original Doom Patrol comics and there's some weird an wild stuff in there that's damn near up to Morrison in bizarreness.

>a chorus is heard going “Whyyy?”<

500 pages of Aparo B&W art? Who'd need a reason to justify THAT?

(Same deal with the second Brave & The Bold volume)

There is that; it's just that BatO always did have a hard-knock life when it comes to how people regard the title. the new version didn't fare much better in that regard.

Actually I recall it being something contractual with most of the comics in that period and I'm sorry that I don't have anything better than vague remembrances to go by.

The Hex volume stops being Jonah Hex about two thirds of the way through and fills it out the page count with another western serial that isn't half as entertaining and those "contractual problems" were the reason I've heard of for this odd break and lack of any further volumes.

Random Stranger -- digging around it seems to be to do with payment/royalty issues, possibly with John Albano as apparently he quite writing the series when the original movie deal was set up and he didn't get anything from it. Could be payments to Michael Fleischer too, I have no idea.

The second SP Jonah hex volume keeps getting listed in places, but then again does the canceled Suicide Squad title.

Aha...that's what it as. An issue spcific to the back-of-check contract they were using from 1977-1997 or so, which laid out reprint fees per page rather than royalty structures. They're renegotiating for royalties on post-1979 ,material, which is what stopped the second Hex volume, Suicide Squad, and others. Whether this is what caused a third of the first Jonah Hex book to consist of support material from the series where the original stories ran, I don't know. It was a mildly disappointing volume.

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