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Comic Book Legends Revealed #185

This is the one-hundred and eighty-fifth in a series of examinations of comic book legends and whether they are true or false. Click here for an archive of the previous one-hundred and eighty-four.

In honor of the chat transcript going up later today between Mark Waid and myself, here is a special All-Waid edition of Comic Book Legends Revealed!!

Let’s begin!

COMIC LEGEND: Waid and Alex Ross were forced to use Alan Scott instead of Hal Jordan in Kingdom Come.

STATUS: False

A few people have asked me this question in various phrasings over the years, but reader Florian was the most recent AND the one who asked this specific variation on the question:

When Mark Waid and Alex Ross did Kingdom Come a few years ago, Ross refused the use of Kyle Rayner as Green Lantern in the story, rather wanting Hal Jordan in the role. DC didn’t like the idea because Jordan was still used as the villainous Parallax at the time, so they ended up using Alan Scott as the only Green Lantern in the story.

By the way, Kingdom Come is over a dozen years old. That’s hard for me to believe. Comic Book Resources actually started up as a Kingdom Come fan-site! Times surely have a-changed.

In any event, I asked Waid about this awhile back, and he said (note that Waid explicitly added that this is based on what he recalls from twelve years ago, and was not presuming to speak for Alex Ross) that, basically, yeah, they did not want to use Kyle Rayner in Kingdom Come.

However, Alan Scott was not forced upon them, but something they came up with on their own.

Alan is on the top right of this Absolute Kingdom Come cover (click to enlarge)….

Here is a recent action figure made of the Kingdom Come Alan Scott…

You could obviously argue that they came up with him on their own because they figured DC wouldn’t let them use Hal, who was still Parallax at the time, if they DID want to use him, but in the end, it was their decision, not DC’s.

In fact, Waid recalled only one thing being “forced” upon he and Ross, and that was that Superman would have to have long hair in the flashbacks, as he did in the comics at the time.

Note that Ross, in the flashbacks, makes a point to have it be a ponytail and not the mullet look of 1993-96.

Oddly enough, Superman cut his hair just a few short months after Kingdom Come ended.

So yeah, sorry, Kyle Rayner fans! The Kingdom Come guys weren’t big fans! But at least DC did not force them to use Alan Scott!

Thanks to Florian (and others) for the question, and thanks to Mark Waid for the answer!

COMIC LEGEND: The Kang who appeared in Waid’s second run on Captain America was originally meant to be the actual Kang.

STATUS: True

Reader Miken asked me this one back in May:

At the beginning of Mark Waid’s Heroes Return Cap run they immediately establish Kang is up to something. Then eventually he’s shown ressurecting the Red Skull. Then toward the end of the Skull arc we find out the Watcher guiding Cap through previous issues was actually Kang in disguise, who is then revealed as being Korvac. This never really sat well with me, because for what reason would Korvac need to be disguised as Kang when bringing back the Skull?

Well when the Kang subplot in Cap was still looming Avengers Forever started, and at the time I was wondering how this would tie to Captain America if at all. (Time travellers can have many simultaneous appearances without contradiction) But anyway was Kang changed to Korvac at last minute due to him being in AF?

I never got around to asking Waid, so I actually asked him in the chat that you’ll see transcribed Friday around noon Pacific, and he went into great detail there, so you can read the chat for the precise details, but I’ll give you the general ones right now…

Yeah, Miken, Kang was originally going to be the bad guy but Kurt Busiek asked Waid early on if Busiek could have Kang (this was pre-Avengers Forever, but certainly that’s what Busiek was thinking about). However, as Kurt himself notes in the comments, while Waid believed that he was being asked not to use Kang at all, Kurt originally planned for the two to BOTH use Kang (since he was a time-traveler, after all, he could be in both stories without a conflict). A nameless editor, though, told Waid that Kang was off the table, so Waid went along with it.

The interesting thing that Waid noted was that Korvac was not originally the person who was going to be impersonating Kang. Originally, Korvac was going to be impersonating Thanos over in Waid’s Ka-Zar run!

But someone called dibs on Korvac then (Waid no longer recalls who), so Waid told the Ka-Zar story with Thanos being, well, Thanos.

So when Korvac ended up NOT being used by the other writer, Waid brought him over to Cap.

Isn’t it funny how this stuff all seems to eventually work out?

Thanks to Miken for the question and thanks to Mark Waid for the answers! And additional thanks to Kurt Busiek for the clarifying information!

COMIC LEGEND: Waid’s original origin for Onslaught was that he was simply the evil side of Professor X.

STATUS: True

Reader Cousin Dick asked me the following over two years ago:

Is there any truth to the rumor that Mark Waid had a different origin for Onslaught?

The rumor I heard was that part of their disagreement was over Onslaught’s origin. I heard that Waid wanted Onslaught to be a long-suppressed part of Xavier’s personality, whereas Lobdell wanted Onslaught to be caused by Magneto’s corruption of Xavier.

Can’t find the answer to this anywhere, but maybe you know people like Waid who you can contact and find the real story.

Ultimately, the major villain Onslaught did, in fact, turn out to be created when Professor X was forced to mind-wipe Magneto during the Fatal Attractions storyline. When Xavier wiped Magneto’s mind, he ended up gaining some of Magneto’s personality, which ultimately corrupted Xavier and created the Onslaught entity – a bad guy powered by perhaps the most powerful telepath on Earth.

Once Onslaught was defeated, Xavier was back to normal (although powerless for awhile).

But what WAS Mark Waid’s original plan for Onslaught?

Well, here is a sneak peek from the chat, where Waid basically confirms cousindick’s take on the story word for word….

Brian Cronin: Speaking of rumors, we had another one: “What was your original Onslaught origin?”
Mark Waid: The original take on Onslaught–and whether or not this would have been a good idea is open for debate, because I’ve always been the first to say that I wasn’t a great fit on X-Men–
Mark Waid: –is that it was just intended to be Xavier’s dark side that had been percolating for decades. IMHO, the last-minute decision to shoehorn Magneto into the mix was a confusing misstep. But maybe not. Again, I’m not the best judge of anything X.


So there ya go!

Thanks to cousindick for the question, and thanks to Mark Waid for the answers!

By the way, for a previous installment of Comic Book Legends Revealed about how Lobdell created Onslaught before actually figuring out who/what Onslaught WAS, check here!

Okay, that’s it for this week!

Feel free (heck, I implore you!) to write in with your suggestions for future installments! My e-mail address is cronb01@aol.com.

See you next week!

Be sure to check out the Mark Waid chat transcript on Friday, sometime before noon Pacific-time!

76 Comments

The things you miss out on by not having enough cash for comics in the mid-’90s….

Nice teaser for the Mark Waid transcript, really looking forward to it.

I always thought they’d used Alan Scott simply because they preferred the older “classic” heroes… Like Jay being the Flash and no sign of Wally…

As a kid, I thought the Xavier + Magneto = Onslaught thing worked fine. It made sense as a cost to Xavier putting down Magneto in the fairly unheroic way that he did (which, you know, mattered in 1995).

Those 2 Cap runs, and the Kazar stuff ,was GREAT! When I was running a comic store at that time myself and many customers where very upset whe the 1st Waid run was interuped for Heroes Reborn (as others were im sure). At least they had the sense to bring him back and man, how good was the Avengers in the Heroes Return launch as well? Re: Kingdom Come the latest JSA stuff is tremendous too where people are “turning” into the KC versions like Jay garrick and Alan Scott. Anyways, great Waid edition!

Love Waid!

He’s a terrific writer, of course, but almost never gets props for his editing. His run on Secret Origins was a high point for that series (or series of series).

Looking forward to Mark’s long a-Waid-ed run on Superman after Robinson moves over to that new monthly Krypto comic.

My understanding is that it was never made explicit in Kingdom Come which Green Lantern and which Flash (or which Hawkman, for that matter) you were actually seeing. GL certainly seems to be Alan, given his appearance, and the way Jade acts around him, but he has almost no lines (perhaps none, I’m not sure), and he’s never specifically named. The Flash is wearing Jay’s helmet, but the hints make him seem to be Wally — look how often he’s depicted standing with the other original Titans. The novelization (which was rather poor, in my opinion), specifically states that they’re Alan and Wally, if I recall correctly.

Thanks a lot for reminding me about the Super-Mullet. Really, thanks for that.

Alan Scott makes sense. Hal’s probably dead or crazy so Scott gets his ring. Where John Stewart and Guy Gardner are is … unknown! Honestly, Kingdom Come was never my thing. It’s pretty to look at and there are some interesting concepts but Shakespeare, it ain’t. Alex Ross is the Robert Bateman of Superheroes.(There’s nothing wrong with that, just sayin’.) Been a Waid fan since the Amazing Heroes days.

And Onslaught was similarly not for me. Heroes Reborn looked like a stinky product so I avoided both. Wisely, I think.

I love these legends. Keep up the good work. But go easy on the Super-Mullet. (I’d like to learn more about the whole Electric Superman and if that’s even still in continuity after all those Superboy punches.)

I remember Waid’s comment on Heroes Reborn being to the effect of “Every writer worries he’ll be forgotten because the next guy on the book is so much better …. I don’t think I had that problem.”

The novelization wasn’t bad. It fleshed out some barely-seen characters like Captain Comet, clarified some things that were left vague in the comics. Plus it was written by Elliot S! Maggin, who is awesome.

@ Brian Mac: You know, Flash being Wally in Jay’s helmet does make sense when you take into account the follow-ons like “The Kingdom”, thanks for pointing it out… I just assumed it was Jay because of (A) the helmet, and (B) Jay used to “blur” his features to preserve his identity, just like the Kingdom Come Flash is just a red blur…

Although… And now I’m kicking myself… Is it mentioned in the cover key at all? I can’t remember, but I seem to recall a fair few having their identities listed next to their hero name… (e.g. Batman: Bruce Wayne)

I don’t think the “Super-Mullet” is truly a mullet – more like simply long hair a la Fabio (I remember Maggie Sawyer, in one of her best moments, specifically making that analogy.)

But it’s amusing to me how DC really *did* seem to think the long-hair look was there to stay. I’d love to hear the behind-the-scenes story on that. It made a certain amount of sense to have the long hair in his immediate “return” days, but why DC had him keep it long afterwards, I don’t know.

I do remember seeing Long-Hair Superman continue to show up in some licensed products *long* after he got a haircut in the comics. Past the turn of the century, if I’m not mistaken.

I have a Mullet-Superman tie. I treasure it.

Great installment. Except…

Superman did not have a mullet.

He just didn’t. The man had long hair. That was it. Mullets are very specific. Short in the front, long in the back or as people have joked business up front, party in the rear.

Billy Ray Cyrus has a mullet in 1992.

David Spade sported one in JOE DIRT.

Superman didn’t.

You can pull your hair back in a pony tail as he did in the comics and in KINGDOM COME if you have a mullet because there is nothing up front to pull back.

I remember reading the initial origin of Onlsaught (Xavier’s long suppressed dark side given form) and thinking “awesome!”

Then a few issues later, when it was revealed that Onslaught was actually born of a piece of Magneto’s consciousness that Xavier acquired when mind-wiping Magneto (personified by a little pink demon-y thing hoping aboard on the astral plane), I thought “wow, that’s incredibly lame.”

The X-Men were my gateway comic and by the beginning of Onslaught, I was still at a point where I liked whatever was happening simply because it was happening to the X-Men. I think my reaction to Magneto’s influence on Onslaught was the first time the rose-colored glasses came off and when I stopped seeing the stories as infallible.

As for Alan Scott in Kingdom Come, honestly, every time I’ve read it (and I haven’t read it in some time) I just always assumed the GL featured in it was an older Hal.

Now I have to wonder if I’m just stupid and completely missed something in it in which it’s clarified to be Alan…

His bangs were significantly shorter than the back. On a man, that equals mullet.

“My understanding is that it was never made explicit in Kingdom Come which Green Lantern and which Flash (or which Hawkman, for that matter) you were actually seeing. GL certainly seems to be Alan, given his appearance, and the way Jade acts around him, but he has almost no lines (perhaps none, I’m not sure), and he’s never specifically named. The Flash is wearing Jay’s helmet, but the hints make him seem to be Wally — look how often he’s depicted standing with the other original Titans. The novelization (which was rather poor, in my opinion), specifically states that they’re Alan and Wally, if I recall correctly.”

In the Kingdom follow up we find out for sure that it is Wally Flash. Of course, that was done with no input from Ross, so how cannon you want to consider it is open.

Supermans mullet, Kingdom Come, Onslaught, Heroes Reborn, Avengers Forever…has it really been over a decade already?!? Wow.

The super faux-mullet looked OK on Superman, but Clark with the ponytail looked ridiculously stupid. That being said, does the modern day Superman have the same issues with hair as the silver age Superman? In other words, does it not grow under a yellow sun and can he only cut it with heat vision?

I always assumed GL in Kingdom Come was an older Hal Jordan, too. Granted, at the time the only DC books I had ever read were Batman, and maybe 2 issues of Justice League. So I didn’t really know of any other Green Lanterns.

IIRC:

At the end of Kingdom Come, Alan Scott is seen being the representative for Oa. There is a nametag in front of him.

I think it’s really wonderful that Waid is so open about the fact that he wasn’t so great with the X-Men. He is certainly a fantastic writer; his latest Spider-Man story’s one of the best Spidey’s stories I’ve read in a good while. It’s great that he can be humble about this. If only the other creators of that time period – Lobdell, Nicieza, Powers, Jim Lee – would’ve realized the same, and left sooner!

There is a shot in issue #4 of Green Lantern being shot through the leg by an arrow. Since Alan Scott’s ring has a weakness to wood (not the color yellow), this was the major clue that it was the golden age Green Lantern.

The “color yellow weakness” is and always was soooo stupid. At least once a year, some lame, insignificant villain would decide to paint himself and his weapon yellow, thus rendering Hal Jordan all but useless. At least the wood-weakness Alan Scott has meant only a couple of dudes with crossbows or spears could put him down (although I suppose he would also be felled by a “sprig of mistletoe” as was Balder The Brave.

That being said, does the modern day Superman have the same issues with hair as the silver age Superman? In other words, does it not grow under a yellow sun and can he only cut it with heat vision?

Post-Crisis Superman’s hair *does* grow under a yellow sun, but can only be cut with heat vision (and industrial-strength mirrors.) He has to shave regularly, too.

>> Yeah, Miken, Kang was originally going to be the bad guy but Kurt Busiek asked Waid early on if Busiek could have Kang (this was pre-Avengers Forever, but certainly that’s what Busiek was thinking about).>>

Close, but not quite.

When AVENGERS FOREVER’s storyline came together very quickly (and with Mark’s help), I realized I’d need to use Kang, so Mark and I worked out a way that we could both use him — he’s a time-traveler, after all, he could have two things going on at once.

So AVENGERS FORVER got under way — and then someone decided that since I was using Kang, clearly Mark couldn’t, and told his editor to have Mark change his plans, all without asking either me or Tom Brevoort if we actually needed Kang exclusively. Which we didn’t, since we’d already planned around the fact that Mark would be using him.

So Mark changed his plans in a hurry, assuming that this was a determination that had been made with Tom’s and my involvement. It wasn’t, and by the time I heard about it, it was too late to go back to the original plans. The miscommunication tango.

So I borrowed Kang with Mark’s permission, and then Marvel higher-ups took Kang unnecessarily away from Mark. That’ll teach him to be accommodating!

kdb

Thanks a lot, Kurt, for the extra information! I edited it into the piece!

Thanks, Kurt! My bad. It was a long time ago, and Kurt of all people will know all the reasons why I took a wire brush to my brain to scrub out memories of that era of Marvel. No slight intended to Kurt in my initial comments, either!

Does anyone have the finite resolution to the whole Kang, Immortus, Rama Tut, Scarlet Centurian, Doctor Doom, Reed Richards, Nathaniel Richards and Iron Lad fiasco? I’m usually pretty good with this crap, but I’m still quite confused.

My understanding (more than likely very flawed) is as follows. Nathaniel Richards is Reed’s father who goes to the future – becomes Kang, who goes back to ancient Egypt and becomes Rama Tut. Rama ends up in the present, meets Doctor Doom, and suggests they may be ancestors or maybe even the same being. Rama goes back to the future, splits up somehow to become Kand (again) Immortus and The Scarlet Centurian as well (an unholy trinity?). All the time travelling created hundreds of divergent Kangs and they get together to form a club. Iron Lad is (I guess) an adolescent version of Nathaniel Richards, who has yet to become Kang, but hates his future self.

Am I even close?

King Kurt is such a fanboy.

(Aren’t we all?)

And it wasn’t a mullet. The technical name for it is “girly hair.”

That was the “Girly-Haired Superman,” officially.

Just so you know.

RE: Alan Scott in Kingdom Come

If memory servers, in the final issue where GL is sat at the UN, his ring is clearly visible as the Alan Scott ring, not one of the more stylized GL Corps rings…

The festering, dark side of Xavier’s personality had already been defeated back in the X-Men/Micronauts crossover, so it would have been very strange for it to pop up again as Onslaught.

@Anonymous: you gave me a headache, I love all that stuff related to time traveling and alternate universes, but you are right, the Kang stuff is really confusing, I dunno if maybe there is something about it in some handbook. I’m gonna look for that in my comics.

PD: that Alan Scott figure is awesome. Peace.

i just want to say that i think that its very kool for both Kurt Busiek and Mark Waid to leave comments to join in with us ‘reg’lar folks’ on this site.
By the way, they have been my two favorite writers in comics for a long time. Thanks Gents!

If I’m not mistaken, the character that Waid wanted to use in Ka-Zar and didn’t get to was THE HIGH EVOLUTIONER, who was appearing elsewhere at the time.

So he used Thanos instead, even if the first one had a more logical interest in the Savage Land.

Funny thing is that when Starlin came back to Marvel he established that that Thanos wasn’t even the real Thanos, but a doppleganger (the same for the ones in Thor and Celestial Quest…).

Sorry Mark! You should have choose Forbush Man in the first place!

Great series of legends here. I always assumed the GL in Kingdom Come was an older Hal (As in the early 90s Hal was suddenly graying and put on the same age level as Ollie, who was always supposed to be significantly older than the other heroes.). Once I read the story, it was clear to me it was supposed to be Alan Scott.

As for the Kingdom Come flash I was always under the impression that it was one of two things 1) It’s a living manifestation of the Speedforce who chooses to look like its three most prominent users or 2) Using the speedforce combined Wally, Barry and Jay into the same being. It would seem Geoff Johns’ take on this is a hybrid of these two ideas, as we can see in “Thy Kingdom Come/One Nation, Under Gog.”

All around very good.

@Anonymous-
kinda sorta close except that Kang isn’t Reed Richards’ father, although they both have the same name.

Unless things have changed again – Nathaniel Richards goes to an alternate universe before the FF are formed. He marries and Kang is his descendant from his second wife. After discovering the time machine of an ancestor (possibly Richards or Doom), he goes to ancient Egypt and assumes his first (perhaps) alternate identity as Rama Tut. He eventually goes to the future, meets Dr.Doom, and is inspired to become the Scarlet Centurion. Some versions of him stick with this identity and one of them goes on to be the foe of the Squadron Supreme. Some versions of him travel further into the future and become Kang. One Kang tires of his conquests, returns to his Rama Tut identity and life. This Rama Tut is approached by the Time-Keepers to be the guardian of Limbo for, IIRC, the timespan in which he reigned in his various identities. This Rama Tut becomes Immortus.

Kang may or may not have been Iron Lad once. Kang rescues a younger version of himself for a beating that would have left him in a coma. The more idealistic teenager is horrified with what he discovers he will become and gathers the Young Avengers to oppose his older self. This causes wonky things to happen with time and the first arc of that series does end with his teenage self returned to the future and wiped of his memories of his actions as Iron Lad.

That’s clean, straightforward character development at its finest.

I remember being super-excited at the revelation that Onslaught was created by a suppressed dark side of Prof X’s psyche. I lost interest rapidly when this turned out not to be the case. This was me as a 14-yr old book critic, realizing that some concepts are simply stronger than others.

Re: Kingdom Come. I’ve always loved Kyle Rayner, but thought having Alan as the GL in that story was great. Like the mysterious Flash, it suggested that something big had happened and left me wondering what it could be.

Laurence, the ending of X-Men/Micronauts never made much sense to me. If the Entity was Xavier’s dark side, then how could it be destroyed without Xavier’s personality changing? If it was really destroyed, wouldn’t Xavier suddenly become a saint?

Thanks, Matty. I didn’t know about the two Nathaniel Richards’, naturally assuming they were one and the same. Sort of uncomplicates certain relationships, such as Kristoff Vernard, who’s father’s name is supposedly Nathaniel Richards, and Huntara, likewise.

Sorry, meant the High Evolutionary…

I always wondered why Hal Jordan was not used for KC as it seemed to me the most logical (given the time period KC took place) as Alan must have been pushing well over the 100’s age wise in that unknown future.

Besides I find the reason “Hal was Parallax at the time so he was not used for KC” to be quite silly as KC to me was always more of an Elseworlds story that may or may not be DCs future, so what should it matter what Hal was in current continuity? For the record I did like Alan in KC, but not using Hal when Wally was the Flash always seemed strange to me.

Regardless its cool to hear from both Mark and Kurt on stuff like this.

Were there ever any plans to have Nathaniel Richards (Cable) be some sort of relation to Reed Richards?

“If the Entity was Xavier’s dark side, then how could it be destroyed without Xavier’s personality changing? If it was really destroyed, wouldn’t Xavier suddenly become a saint?”

Are you saying that he didn’t? :P

The 1990’s was just a horrible decade for super-heroes.

Sorry, I didn’t hear you.
What did you mean?
High what?

Cable’s name isn’t Nathaniel Richards, it’s Nathan Summers. He’s Cyclops’ son.

And for the record, after reading the Lee/Kirby era of the X-Men, I’m fully willing to believe that Professor X had a dark side that would enable him to become Onslaught. Heck, the very first issue of “X-Men” had him putting the team through a “training exercise” that involved the Beast chucking a bowling ball at Iceman’s head when his back was turned, to “test his reflexes”.

Were there ever any plans to have Nathaniel Richards (Cable) be some sort of relation to Reed Richards?

“Unlikely, sir. They spell and pronounce their names differently.”

(Cable is Nate Summers, not Richards. Though with so many Nathans being bandied about, the confusion is understandable)

Brian From Canada

December 12, 2008 at 8:10 pm

Case in point: Madelyne told Nathan Summers that the idea for his name was supplanted subconsciously by Sinister, who was one Nathaniel Essex.

IIRC, wasn’t Jim Shooter slated to do a Korvac/Avengers mini at Marvel around that time that fell apart? Could he have been the reason Korvac was “off the table?”

I seem to recall quite a bit of talk about something like that around that time…

I recall seeing Alan Scott’s ring on the Green Lantern’s hand at the end where he’s a representative and out of the green armor. At the time I was heavily interested in the Green Lantern Corps and the various lineage, even tho I wasn’t really reading the Kyle series, and recognized the ring right off. I don’t recall seeing a name tag, tho.

Don’t forget Prof. X’s creepy pedophilic crush on Jean Grey also…

Marianne Cox Walloer

December 12, 2008 at 8:57 pm

They should really bring back Thanos. Thanos = Good Marvel. See how easy that was?

I often debated to myself how bad or good the Onslaught stuff was. Comparing it to Marvel’s big events now I think it shows why it was so good and what they are failing at now. It doesn’t seem to even matter that Cap’s dead because CW didn’t seem like a Marvel crossover styleistically. That’s a debate for another forum, though.

Not to put Waid down, I loved his Captain America stuff and other stuff he’s done, but just having Xaviers ‘evil’ side come to life isn’t enough as an explanation of who Onslaught was or what he is. I have to assume there’s more to it than that or Xavier just becomes evil which you can also do. I always thought X-Men was the best comic book of all time, I haven’t changed my opinion of that too much.

Loved Avengers forever, too. Great stuff.

First, like Mr. Cronin, I have fond memories of this site’s roots as the Kingdom Come Message Board, home of the Pantheon! Thanks for noting that. It has certainly come a long way from Jonah’s humble beginnings.

On the issue of who Green Lantern was in Ross’ and Waid’s work (along with Flash and Hawkman), I always subscribed to what a more learned member of the KCMB called the “Avatar Theory”. I liked the deliberate ambiguity of those characters, since they incorporated elements of all three of the major incarnations (Scott/Jordan/Paralax, Jay/Barry/Wally, Carter/Katar/Hawkgod) of that time (sorry fans of Kyle, I couldn’t get on board with him either).

I thought it was a brilliant approach. There had really been only ONE Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman since their introduction, even though they’d experienced (or, in some cases, suffered) some reinterpretations over the years. But each of those “lesser three” for DC’s pantheon had been nipped and tucked repeatedly. A fate suffered by Green Arrow and Aquaman only once in their runs. It was a great way to represent the CONCEPT rather than any one interpretation into the story.

I’ve always thought that Onslaught was both Xavier’s longstanding dark side and Magneto’s rage combined. In fact, isn’t that explicitly stated?

Man, even though I objectively knew that Kingdom Come was written during the Parallax years it never clicked with me that the GL used was Alan Scott. I read it when I was very new to comics and hearing a lot about Green Lantern: Rebirth, so I just assumed that the Green Lantern in it was Hal with gray hair, and that Alan’s recent use of the armor was just a visual nod in a KC related story.

I thought the KC Hawkman had a great visual, but the whole eco-terrorist angle didn’t feel true to the character. Was this incarnation meant to be Carter/Khufu at the time, or is he actually Northwind, as depicted in later JSA stories?

I did like the fact that the legacy heroes covered multiple eras. It made the setting feel more legit since at any given time in the “real” DCU, John Stewart might be GL, Connor Hawke might be Green Arrow, Wally West/Flash, etc in all manner of permutations.

Super-Mullet LOL
I always remember the Hitman issue where the gang try to start a petition for a Superman haircut.
And is a mullet.

Some time before the definitive Starlin explanation of Thanos presence in Ka-Zar (in Infinity Abyss, I think) Peter David explained it in his Captain Marvel run as Thanos “testing” several heroes for a task he had in mind (in an issue drawn by Jim Starling, no less).

I remember giving up on the whole Onslaught storyline because of the whole Magneto in the Professor’s head stupidity. I had long assumed he was just a renamed and more powerful version of The Entity, the evil side of Prof from early in the Claremont years. All the Magneto stuff just seemed to me to be posted on crap, which I was quickly learning was the tell-tale of the Bob Harras Marvel.

Xavier has had at least two times where his dark side came out before the Onslaught thing (and the cop-out of it being because of the darkness in Magneto’s soul): a fill-in issue of Uncanny X-Men #106 (although not yet called uncanny) and the X-Men/Micronauts crossover mini-series. As Mike Carey’s X-Men: Legacy series is showing, there really hasn’t been an era where the good Professor really was quite so squeaky clean.

That was Alan Scott in Kingdom Come? Hell, I always thought it was Hal.

Can anyone tell me if Brian has any HellBlazer/Constantine installments in the archives?

If not, I’d love to see one, and I’m sure there’s ample territory to mine there. Most of the articles tend to focus on superheroes. Between the lost Ellis issue and Moore having “met him” on multiple occasions, it would be great in Brian’s hands.

Tano

>> IIRC, wasn’t Jim Shooter slated to do a Korvac/Avengers mini at Marvel around that time that fell apart? Could he have been the reason Korvac was “off the table?”>>

No, Jim’s Korvac project was in the works a few years later, around the time Englehart was doing CELESTIAL QUEST.

kdb

Another great installment. Mark Waid is one of the all-time greats. And Superman totally had a mullet, btw. It was short up front because they kept the spit curl.

FunkyGreenJerusalem

December 14, 2008 at 11:58 pm

Ahhh, Onslaught… good times.

How awesome was it when Wolverine didn’t have a nose?

In fact, Waid recalled only one thing being “forced” upon he and Ross, and that was that Superman would have to have long hair in the flashbacks, as he did in the comics at the time.

Weird. I was always impressed with that as an example of attention to detail, and never even considered that it would have been editorially mandated.

ParanoidObsessive

December 15, 2008 at 1:32 am

>>> As Mike Carey’s X-Men: Legacy series is showing, there really hasn’t been an era where the good Professor really was quite so squeaky clean.

Well, even aside from the whole “why don’t I recruit a bunch of teenagers and get them to fight dangerous terrorists” angle that already starts him out a few notches down the morality ladder, it’s hard to see someone as being completely squeaky clean when he says all the time about how horrible it is to use his powers to mess with people’s heads, and then he doesn’t actually hesitate to erase people’s memories or fuzz out their impressions of the X-Men if there’s a threat to their identities or something.

And during Secret Wars, he basically decided fairly quickly to team up with Magneto and act as a spoiler force rather than siding with the other heroes, which was a bit opportunistic to say the least.

And that doesn’t even take into account the fact that Xavier has lied to the X-Men on multiple occasions, casually not mentioning things to them that they probably should know, like the fact that he and Magneto used to hang out together, or that he knows this Scottish chick who has an entire island set up to imprison dangerous mutants, and so on.

And even leading into the whole Onslaught business, there was the revelation that Xavier was apparently keeping detailed notes on how to kill pretty much everyone he knew if they went bad – which is itself hardly saint-like behavior…

I liked the Xavier corrupted by Magneto, but the little pink demon was stupid.

Magneto probably wasn’t really needed I suppose. Still, the Magneto-esque armor was pretty cool in a 90’s kind of way. Then they turned him into some weird monster Venom looking thing and that is when the whole deal jumped the shark, as they say.

I second the praise for Mark Waid’s Spider-Man story. The only time in years, since long before the whole CW/OMD/BND debacle that I’ve actually read a REAL, classic spider-story which got everything right and managed to be innovative at the same time. I’ve said it on Newsarama and I’ll say it here: Mark Waid should be the next full-time Spider-scribe on Amazing.

No offense ot Mark Waid, or anyone working on the Spider-man books now, but the book is beyond saving. Peter Parker is a person not worth saving and doesn’t have a history anymore…. or maybe everyone ‘forgot’ it doesn’t matter. Everyone on those books (especially Waid) are more deserving to work on a better book. I hope they find one.

Yeah, the KC GL is definitely Scott, as he has a weakness to Ollie’s arrows.
But it never made sense to me that he’s GL and Wally’s Flash. The two of them have a few subtle ‘moments’ together throughout the series (when Supes forms the new JLA, they look at each other like “Great to see you buddy, isn’t it great to be back in action together?”) but it’s Hal who has a shared history w/Wally.
I just pretend it IS Hal, it’s not hard if you wanna.

Plus I am a Kyle fan <=0)

I know I’m late to the discussion as usual, but I was expecting to find a link somewhere here to that chat transcript Brian said was going up later between him and Mark Waid, but unless I missed it somehow, I’m not seeing it, and I didn’t have any luck searching CBR and Google. Can anyone out there hook me up? Thanks!

By the way, keep up the great work, Brian! This column is my favorite online comics page, and I look forward to it each week!

I know I’m late to the discussion as usual, but I was expecting to find a link somewhere here to that chat transcript Brian said was going up later between him and Mark Waid, but unless I missed it somehow, I’m not seeing it, and I didn’t have any luck searching CBR and Google. Can anyone out there hook me up? Thanks!

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2008/12/12/mark-waid-chat-transcript/

Thanks, Brian!

How does Superman get a haircut? Laser cutters? I mean, he’s the ‘man of steel’. Seems like he couldn’t just, ya know, go to Super Cuts.

[…] The connection between Fatal Attractions and Onslaught was a mind-fuck of a twist, because it was a tack-on. It just doesn't fit with what came before in the story. His Generation-X NEVER changed artists […]

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