And you can’t be prepared against every situation, no matter who you are. And to think his plans and contigencies would work the entire time it’s false. No one foresees every variable in a figth or in life, sorry. And when you plan so much, you may not be ready for the unexpected, because you always act according to plan, and that’s what you know. (I didn’t see him prepared in FC2, or avert every single crisis). And I wouldn’t imagine a slow enough fight for batman to prepare and carry out every contingency he has as the fight goes on. I know that a person without powers could be as, or more dangerous that someone with powers. But you can’t overlook someone who has them and knows how to use them very well.

And Spidey also started a trend when he started remember, a teenage hero, with personal problems and every day situations that any reader can relate. That had influence on other books as well. Respect to villains (I also like batman’s rogue gallery, especially two-face), I agree that the goblin is a composite in a certain way of those characters, but I also look at his actions, and how they reflect on the hero. The murder of G. Stacy, spidey’s daughter at the end of the clone saga, ben reilly (the only guy in the world peter considered as his brother) the corruption of his own son, when he crippled flash thompson, etc. That is what makes him work for me. Although I don’t like what they done with him now.

Respect to the cartoons, yes Batman started a trend there, but to see those trend improve is what I like. That is why I prefer Spectacular. But we will continue to disagree because we look at different characteristics in heroes. So, as you said, let’s agree to disagree.

By the way it has been years since I wrote anything in english, it took almost half an hour to write this. A nice exercise though, so I thank you for making me disagree.

I think Spider-Man has a great rogues gallery, I really do. But goblin in particular I find it to be a composite of Two-Face, Lex Luthor and The Joker. Of course he’s brilliantly mad, he has a little bit of Joker’s insanity. Of course he has a split personality in constant turmoil, he’s a little like Two-Face. Of course he has plans within plans, he behaves like Luthor. But what he isn’t, is original (although I give him points for the Gwen Stacy affair, that was bold and trend-setter). And any character can be interesting given the proper writer, but some of them are so well defined, that many of them can get a grasp on them. Carnage, to me was a product of the hyper violent 90s current, a classical example of flash over sustance.

Finally the heroes in other media. Well, that’s my point with Batman, he’s such and interesting (and surprisingly flexible) character, that many great creators tend to gravitate to his orbit, expecting to depict Batman as they see it. Case in point, the new Batman movies. With those there, the bar has been raised, and is forcing (I hope so) other superhero movies to up the ante (and I also hope, studios realized it wasn’t the dark element that made them good, it was the nolan’s meticulous craftmanship and respect for the source).

Batman was in no way a completely new archetype when he was created, but over the years, he has become so well defined and iconic, that most of his depictions (be good or bad) have been trend-setters. I think Spectacular Spidey, and the ’90s animated series are both fantastic products, but they took the Batman TAS model. Now you may not like it, but you can’t deny how influential still is. Even the new, more light Brave and the Bold, is a great product, and again is a totally different take of the superhero animation studios are making today. I’ll bet it’ll start a trend of campy superhero series for young kids.

I don’t think Spidey, ironically, has that flexibility. I don’t know how many series or movies that tell the same story all over again can be. Batman will be read 200 years from now. Spidey can stick to surfaces, but I don’t think has the same great staying power that the dark knight detective has.

Respect to carnage I put him as an example because of raw power, he could be written better, I mean he is also like a counterpart of spidey, in the way of all that power, but none of the responsability. In term of spidey villains I prefer the goblin. He is the guy who has plans within plans within plans, and is prepared for every contingency and certainly has the means to destroy spider-man, yet he hasn’t. I know that they have a different history and a more personal relationship, but the most the guy could do was take out his spider-sense. And he had access to genetic material of Spidey (see revelations the end of the clone saga), and he got into every aspect of his life. But that is a different story.

I agree with you with the movies, but it is difficult for me to compare the new batman movies with the superhero movie genre, it`s done a very different way than the usual comic movies are done, but that is because of the director’s choice, to stablish it in a more real world setting. For example I personally can’t compare Spider-Man 2 (love that train scene, when you see him at his greatest) with the dark knight, and I love them both, they are my favorite movies. It is easier for me to compare the spiderman movies with the first two batman’s (which to me also rocked, especially returns). And they both have some of the worst (comics) movies, Batman and Robin and it pains me too say Spidey 3, I had a lot of hopes for that one, they should remake it. All I want is a great fourth movie (after the third i’m sure they can’t get anyway but up). At least they weren’t Catwoman. But it’s a matter of opinion, for example I don’t like much the animated series of batman, some of them even bore me. And I’m sure I’m not the only one. In animated series I prefer The spectacular Spider-man, the villains are awesome, it’s one big story and the characters grow as the series progress. By the way I saw season two here and it is very good. Too bad they don’t repeat many episodes here on tv. But I’ll wait to the dvd’s.

Still for me the winner is Spidey, no matter batman’s plans or gadgets, he can overcome those. But each of us has their own personal hero, and that’s what matters, so that’s the actual winner.

See ya.

It’s a matter of opinion, BenJS. The fact that a character doesn’t have superpowers doesn’t mean he’s not dangerous. I’ve been reading comics quite a while, and if Batman has an ability, is that he’ll eventually defeat any kind of enemy he’s pitted against (even Didio or Grant Morrison). Batman’s a strategist, he’s a master strategist actually, he’s got contingency plans that has contingency plans. Spider-Man’s is good at science, and good at thinking on his feet, that’s all. Batman’s a polymath with a keen and sharp analytical mind, and a deadly imagination. And he also has the means (wealth) to develop his plans.

Hell, if they had a previous encounter, He has probably deduced the source of Peter’s powers, and maybe he has found a way to neutralize his spider-powers.

And about the villains… We’ll have to agree in disagree. The Joker and many rogues in Batman’s gallery is what villains want to be when they grow up. As a matter of fact, in In the first Bat-Spider Crossover, Carnage approached the Joker to learn from him. The Joker even said to him that he saw himself at the Orson Welles of Crime, while Carnage only aspired to be the “David Hasselhoff” of it.

Batman, all the way. Batman defeats Spidey in any scenario. And not just in the comics world. He’s had the best animation, the best movies, the WORST movie (and he turned the tide. Come on, Spiderman 3 was bad, but it was not Batman and Robin), and a more memorable bad live-action tv series.

No one can really expect batman to win in a physical fight against spidey, no matter how smart he is (Spidey isn´t exactly dumb you know), or how many gadgets he has. It`s not the same beating the penguin, or the joker, than beating Venom, carnage, dr. octopus or the green goblin. Plus you think just because the other guy is smart and wears some sort of armor he would win? (Parker should be dead if that it’s the case); Peter it’s way faster (at least twenty times, faster because of his spìder-sense), way stronger, and agile than batman, and has a lot of experience, it is a fact, not things to ignore just because of favouritism (I know spidey against superman wouldn’t last 1 sec, same with green lantern). Not to mention spidey’s resistance and stamina (well documented in many comics in his 47 years of existence, check amz 31 to 33 for example, great story btw). It would be a good, interesting fight, the DK would make sure of that, but spidey would win for sure. Now if Spidey were a normal human, yeah sure, no contest, it would be over like that. But he is not. Besides they downplay spidey’s powers and experience (new avengers, why they forget he has been a hero longer than anyone on that team, for god’s sake, and he isn’t the new kid on the block) in comics since a few years back. The guy went up against, wolverine (wolvie vs sman oneshot, a tie), most of the x-men (secret wars 3, for example), iron man (amz 535, 544, civil war, etc), firelord (amz 269, 270), juggernaut (amz 229-230), the examples go on and on. He practically fought 75% of the marvel universe, good and bad guys alike.

Back to the choice at hand… Respect to their personalities, I find Spidey’s more interesting and more real than batman’s (a millonaire who is a superhero in his spare time doesn’t ring much true to me, same with iron man). Spidey’s problems are more personal to me, I relate to them. I love everything about the character, the powers, his enemies (which I love and hate at the same time) and he’s the one who got me in to comics. The tragedies he had to overcome, (uncle ben, george stacy, GWEN, jean dewolff, ben reilly -character who should make a comeback now-, et alt) makes him more the hero in my eyes. I do like batman’s motivation though (the death of his parents), and that is something they have in common. They are both trying to prove themselves, to redeem themselves, to people who aren’t there anymore. The two are in a never ending battlle respect to that, and that explains how obssesed they are in their own way, about what they do, about saving people, and you can see them pushing themselves over the edge even to save one life. Their diferences (in personalities and modus operandi) begins in the way they were raised. Spidey without may wouldn`t be the same we know. Or bruce with with may, etc. But of the good guys, taking that into consideration they are two faces of the same coin, one dark, and one more heart lighted (I think that is the expression, feel free to correct me please).

Those are the two more powerful motivations to become a vigilante, a hero. The more beliable. The violent death of your parents, and the guilt of being responsible for the death of the only father figure you knew. In my opinion they are both crazy and obssesed in their own ways because of that. And they will be like that to day they die, figthing for what they believe, with all their hearts.

Bruce is good, but Spidey it’s just great. But for the reasons I wrote above I don’t thimk they would fight, they are both smarter and more responsible than that. It’s a very interesting team up, that I would love to see again, not only as spidey and batman but I would like to see more interaction of their alter egos.

Well again excuse my english and have a good night all of you.

Bye..

Why don’t YOU read what the description says. It says that the voter can use ANY criteria they want. Therefore, if they want the criteria to be “who would win in a fight?”, that’s up to them! And they don’t need to explain in their post that they realize they had other options, because we can understand what they intend from the context of their post because we’re not stupid, which is what you seem to believe. Lighten’ up, dude- WAY up.

It didn’t really matter to me because Batman would win under any set of criteria I tried to devise- although I remain very fond of everyone’s favorite neighborhood web-slinger.

-Citizen Scribbler

The last round of voting begins now!

Simply choose your favorite (whether it be that you think they’re more interesting, more appealing, whatever criteria you want to use) in the following match-up. The voting concludes exactly 24 hours from right now!

FIGURE IT OUT!!!! READ THE TOP OF THE DAMN POST FIRST!!!

Batman has how many graphic novels and trade collections? Many of them quite good. 7 movies, many of them very good. He and Spidey have had about the same number of cartoons, and while the classic Spidey is way more classic, the “good” Batman (TAS) was amazing, revolutionary, and paved the way for the great JLU stuff.

Batman as a character has spawned amazing things in all sorts of media.

But Spidey is Spidey, and he’s everything cool about Marvel (when Marvel was cool). And even though he’s the underdog (as usual) that’s where my vote’s going.

Mind you if Swamp Thing had made it to the finals, Spidey would be compost.

That is all he needs to win.

Way more interesting.

And he’s just a lot cooler, though Spidey does have a better new cartoon show (but lousier old ones)

Batman, Batman, Batman.

NanananananananananaNOT! Batman!