Comments on: Comic Book Legends Revealed #214

By: Ed Buskirk

Ed Buskirk — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 03:42:48 +0000

Purple: "Can't remember who was being interviewed (maybe Feldstein), but the Judgment Day issue is also talked about in the documentary 'Comic Book Confidential'." Feldstein is in "Comic Book Confidential" (talking about Mad), but it was Gaines who told the story of "Judgment Day" in the movie. He called it "one of the finest stories we ever did". "Comic Book Confidential" is an excellent movie. Seeing it for the first time about '88 got me back into comics after about five years away. For me it totally captured everything I thought was great about the medium, and I still watch my VHS copy every year or so. I would love to see an updated version, covering the last twenty-some years. The industry has turned upside-down twice since then, but I'd still recommend the movie to anyone interested in the history of the medium. It covers underground and alternative comics too, and helped broaden my horizons somewhat. Kevin asked if "Judgment Day" had been published in a collection, and in addition to the above mentioned comic-format reprints, the entire line of EC's New Trend books, along with all of the New Direction books and a few of the pre-trend books, were reprinted in oversized, slipcased hardcovers in the '80s, first by Russ Cochran and then by Gemstone. Only the covers are reproduced in color, but the B&W reproduction of the interior pages is beautiful. (I have all but four sets: Weird Science-Fantasy/Incredible Science Fiction, Crime SuspenStories, Frontline Combat and Mad. If anyone has them I'll trade you my soul for them.) In the Bill Gaines interview sections in "Comc Book Confidential", some of these sets can be seen sitting on a shelf behind him in his office. I have also recently seen new hardcover collections, in color, of EC's horror titles. The science-fiction titles may get the same treatment, or may have already, as well they should (the house ads always read "we're proudest of our science-fiction titles".) Hey, Brian, I've noticed 99% of your comic book legends are about superhero comics. Aren't there any legends about underground of alt-comics that don't involve art speigleman?

By: Ronn K.

Ronn K. — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 08:22:57 +0000

Thanks for the specifics, Bob! It's been way to many years since I actually read the story & even then it was in one of the 80 page giant-size books of yesteryear (since I wasn't even a twinkle in my father's eye at the time it was originally published!) along with several other stories. Boy, do I miss those! But regardless of where & when the story took place, I was simply offering info that verifies what the more recent story was inspired by & that the basic idea for the story was, indeed, originally written & published back "in those days", as opposed to merely "7 years ago". But, again, your specific info is much appreciated, thanks!

By: Bob

Bob — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 01:39:18 +0000

@Ronn K.

It should be noted that the original "Superman Red/Superman Blue" was an "Imaginary Story," which is why there were no long term ramifications. Also, the split happened as a result of his attempting to increase his already super-intelligence with an invention powered by a mix of different color kryptonites.

By: Ronn K.

Ronn K. — Sat, 25 Jul 2009 21:52:46 +0000

Please forgive the lateness of this post, as it is going back to July 3 & after looking thru the comments, I don't see anyone else responding to it. Brian From Canada mentions the "Superman Blue/Superman Blue" story & Michael P. responds by saying that the term "In those days" is an incorrect phrase since that particular story only took place "7 yrs. ago". It should be pointed out in Brian's defense that the more recent Superman Red/Blue story was an homage to a previous story published in, I believe, the '50's. I am fairly sure that this is the story that Brian is talking about. While the original story did deal with Supes being split into two separate beings (thru means that I cannot recall specifically, red kryptonite, maybe?), one having no red in his costume & the other having no blue, aside from some reduction in powers, a slight difference in personality & one dating Lois & one dating Lana, the over-all outcome of each story & it's lasting ramifications (or lack thereof) were quite different (no Millennium Giants back in the day!). This should come as no surprise considering that readers of the original story were much less savvy & much more naive "in those days" than the average comic book fans of today, necessitating a much more "realistic & believable" reason for such a thing to happen in the first place, as well as a more "scientifically plausible" resolution. After all, "in those days", exposure to red (& other colors of) kryptonite was used on an almost monthly cycle & the readers at that time had no problem what-so-ever in accepting this as a valid reason & basis for a story. My, how the times have changed! I'm not trying to point a finger at anyone or make them angry, I just thought this should be pointed out. Thanks for "listening"!

By: Paul Ware

Paul Ware — Mon, 20 Jul 2009 08:46:31 +0000

I'd like to take (slight) exception to the comment by Alan Coil that the Code resulted only in bad stories. For some writers, this was undeniably true, as they just knuckled under and did what the Code said. But the Code was also responsible for forcing some other writers to find new and different ways of telling stories, ways that were less visceral and less exploitative and that pandered less to readers' lowest expectations. Let's not forget that the Code probably triggered the existence of the Marvel Universe. Speaking as someone who grew up in the 1960s, I don't think I can over emphasise the imortance of that particular event in my life. The Code was a form of censorship, to which I object tooth and claw, but I defy anyone to prove that it did not lead to the explosion of creativity that Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, et al, experienced once they HAD to tell stories that could only suggest and not show the horrors of life, that required a more introspective and thoughtful approach to a medium that had frequently (though not always) been one that pandered to the lowest common denominator. For more on my thoughts on this and related topics, I refer the interested reader to my fanzine, "reviews from the floor of 64", which covers many of Marvel's early stories via their UK reprints in the Power Comics (free plug; site manager, feel free to remove if it violates your rules and regs!).

By: Sean

Sean — Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:28:48 +0000

"1) Rawhide Kid is gay, but it’s played “straight” (sorry) – as a western gunslinger who just happens to be gay and it doesn’t impact the story at all (in which case why bother?);" "Keep in mind the point of the miniseries was to do something DIFFERENT with the character to get some attention on a possible franchise (which, I think, was the original intent of MAX, before the Alonso-era got toned down a bit)." The idea of doing a gay character where that's just who they are and it has no significant impact on the story would be far more progressive than doing a comic book where the whole thing is a joke, "Hey, isn't it so unusual and funny that this guy can be SO gay and yet SO tough too? I mean, it's really strange, right? STRANGE?" As far as I could tell, that was all Zimmerman had to say, though I'm assuming that the setting precluded his usual Warren Zevon references (so maybe he had those to say too).

By: Mary Warner

Mary Warner — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:56:17 +0000

I thought the anachronistic dialogue in the Rawhide Kid was really annoying. I hope it was done solely for humour, and nobody actually thinks people talked like that in the 19th Century.

By: Roger Jordan

Roger Jordan — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 03:50:25 +0000

An honor to be schooled by Neilalien! I was indeed three issues off.

By: Neilalien

Neilalien — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 02:22:26 +0000

I think the full phrase 'Sanctum Sanctorum' first appears in Strange Tales #125. Doc exclaims, "Mordo!! Here in my own Sanctum Sanctorum!!"

http://www.neilalien.com/doc/archive/2009/07/index.html#a090703

Decent pic from a few years ago of 177 Bleecker Street:

http://www.neilalien.com/doc/archive/2003/03/index.html#a18

By: Callum

Callum — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 19:53:11 +0000

According to Wikipedia regarding Eye for an Eye:
The EC Horror Library, published by Nostalgia Press in 1971, featured color reprints of approximately 20 EC stories, various artist biographies and an essay by Larry Stark. Despite its title, the book also included Bernard Krigstein's famous "Master Race" story from Impact and other selections from non-horror EC titles. This book also featured the first publication of "An Eye For An Eye," originally slated for the final issue of Incredible Science Fiction but rejected by the Comics Code.[22]
[22] ^ Von Bernewitz and Geissman, Ibid., p. 209

By: steve

steve — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 10:34:46 +0000

I love that EC comic. Printing that story in 1953 was pretty bold at that time. I imagine there were few comics speaking out on the topic of civil rights. Even fewer featured an African American as a main character... who wasn't comic relief. I'll have to check out reprints of EC.

By: Callum

Callum — Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:20:22 +0000

I agree with Callen about Weird Fantasy #18's Judgement Day being a part of your Cool Comic Book Moments column.

By: DanCJ

DanCJ — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 12:53:21 +0000

Why do you always have legends about architecture in these posts? Here I am, just trying to enjoy comics, and you’re dragging in the history of buildings. I don’t care if architects get together in private to design skyscrapers and brownstones, but I wish they would keep their designs to themselves.

You're funny!

By: Rob Schmidt

Rob Schmidt — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 12:35:03 +0000

Is there any gay comic that wouldn't also be a "ram down your throat" kind of comic, Shelly? If so, what would it be like? Or are you just prejudiced against gays but unwilling to admit it?

By: James

James — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 21:33:38 +0000

And thanks for the Legends Revealed! My favorite section of this site.

By: James

James — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 21:31:32 +0000

I knew the Rawhide Kid was going to be camp but the dialogue seems anachronistic. The Kid talks just like Jack from Will and Grace.
The artwork is great though.

By: D

Sun, 05 Jul 2009 20:51:29 +0000

Wow, that's cool to hear about Colan doing Cap. Not to knock today's artists, but the older ones just have more flair and style.

By: Roger Jordan

Roger Jordan — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 17:25:03 +0000

You asked when Dr. Strange's home was first referred to as the "Sanctum Sanctorum." The phrase appears to be used for the first time in Strange Tales 128, on page 3 of the Dr. Strange backup feature. (The Human Torch has the lead story.) Strange is battling a bad guy called the Demon, and in panel three, he says "What is this??! The Eye shows nothing!! There is a sinister power at work here -- strong enough to block my own spells! I feel the force thruout this chamber -- I am seemingly helpless -- within my own Sanctum Sanctorum!!" Incidentally, this is the first story in which he is wearing the familiar Cloak of Levitation and Eye of Agamotto amulet, which the Ancient One gave him the previous issue. The Eye he is referring to in the quote above is actually the Orb of Agamotto, as it was called in later issues. The building was referred to as the "sanctum" for the first time in Strange Tales 116.

By: dlfurman

dlfurman — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 13:59:34 +0000

EC Comics Judgement Day reminds me of the short story (IIRC) "Reunion" in Arthur C Clarke's "The Wind From the Sun".

By: Omar Karindu, with the power of SUPER-hypocrisy!

Omar Karindu, with the power of SUPER-hypocrisy! — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 04:15:50 +0000

Why do people who dislike coverage of homosexuality in media persist in using the "shoved down the throat" metaphor? Are they that irony-deficient, or are they all just slightly less self-aware versions of Tobias Funke?