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CSBG Archive

A Year of Cool Comic Book Moments – Day 210

Here is the latest cool comic book moment in our year-long look at one cool comic book moment a day (in no particular order whatsoever)! Here‘s the archive of the moments posted so far!

Today we look at a cool bit from the last issue of Secret Wars…

Secret Wars #12 was by Jim Shooter and Mike Zeck and a gazillion different inkers.

The previous issue ended with Doctor Doom (now possessing the power of the mighty Beyonder) basically killing all of the heroes in Secret Wars in one fell swoop.

That gave us this awesome intro page of Secret Wars #12…

However, Klaw is getting into Doom’s head about thorough of a job that he did killing them…

This leads to this very impressive set-up and knockdown…

That’s pretty sweet.

“The” moment for me is the hammer bit, but damned if that first page isn’t pretty darn sweet, as well.


The coolest part of secret wars is issue 4, the best and most over the top depiction of the power of the hulk, and his relationship with the others, even the cover dark for three quarters with everyone crammed in the bottom next to the text draws you in more then any other, please can you do that soon

The “Moment” was about half-way into the series when my 12 year-old brain finally realized that Jim Shooter was selling me a bunch of stupid bullshit.

If you post anything from Secret Wars II you will have lost all geek cred.

I never read any of these comics: has Klaw always been that gay?

Klaw went from a typical Roy Thomas “heavy” into this cuckoo-loon version with no explanation whatsover. (I guess Shooter needed a voice for the Beyonder to get his cosmic mojo back?) Strangely enough, this series read better in trade paperback form several years ago than when I was twelve. I thought it was okay then, but nothing spectacular.

The various artistic switches didn’t help, either. John Beatty is credited here, but three of the above pages are most likely inked by Al Milgrom. And there’s also one that looks a lot like Art Adams’ work where the heroes fight Doom’s monsters.

The less said of Secret Wars II, the better. I nearly quit reading Marvel comics for good after that.

I remember buying the first few issues of Secret Wars at my local K&B drugstore..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K&B shout-out to people from the Gulf-South

Anyway, about halfway into the run I figured out that the series was pure crap and stopped buying it. I would skim through the issues at that point on their magazine stand and would be thankful that I stopped buying it. Then many moons later when I was flush with cash and buying all sorts of trades of older stuff to revisit my childhood. I bought the trade of Secret Wars and read it all in one sitting to see if it stood the test of time. It did not. It was hilariously bad.

Oh, and Klaw was the stupid crazy lunatic villain patsy ala Psycho-Pirate in Crisis.

I really think that Marv Wolfman pitched something along the lines of a Crisis story-line and Shooter later took the idea when they heard what he was cooking up at DC. I don’t buy the fact that Shooter came up with this concept all on his own. As I’ve previously sent in bit about Wolfman writing a Marvel Two-In-One annual which features cosmic bad guys called the Monitors and there is a character very much like Harbinger in it as well, and the whole story is about the fate of the Earth “hanging in the balance” so obviously he was working on the ideas for Crisis even back when he was working for Marvel.

Man, I fucking hate Secret Wars.

Not gonna try and defend Secret Wars (although I don’t hate it as much as some other commenters), and DEFINITELY not gonna try and defend Secret Wars II, but Klaw didn’t go crazy without explanation. A few years prior to Secret Wars he had been absorbed by Dazzler so that she would have power enough to trouble Galactus – as a result he had spent the past few years knocking around Galactus’ ship as a vibration. OK, maybe not a great explanation, but it’s not like Shooter just decided to portray him that way for a bit of a laugh at the reader’s expense.

Secret Wars II is probably the single worst thing to ever happen to the industry. It was the starting point for pointless mega-crossovers at Marvel where you had to buy all the related books if you wanted to understand the storyline…or rather, lack of. It went on to infect DC with Ostrander’s Legends which was just as bad. Then ever damn summer they had to have a big mega-mini-series just to sell books that were linked to the crossover. Secret Wars helped start the ball rolling and therefore I detest it.

At least with Crisis there was a point to the whole thing (cleaning up continuity, but then we see how that turned out).

With Secret Wars and Secret Wars II there was no point except to sell books based on the fact that this was the biggest thing to hit comics since four-colors and then you would see most of the way into it that they had no idea where the story was heading. It was all pulling stuff out of Jim Shooter’s ass way into the later issues. Hell, the ending is just absurdly stupid.

Awww… be nice to poor, old Secret Wars! Sure, it was bad, terribly, terribly bad, but bad in that campy, cheeseball, fun sort of way. I look back on it with the sort of affection I have for Ed Wood movies or the Dero conspiracy.

But there is nothing cool about it…except maybe the symbiote coming from it, but even then if you read Secret Wars that doesn’t make sense. Spider-Man gets the symbiote costume from some machine that generates it for him. What they don’t explain is that…I think it was Thor, but other heroes get costumes from the SAME DAMN FUCKING MACHINE but none of them had symbiotes plaguing them from then on out.

Hell, even the part about Doom stealing the powers of the Beyonder was just a rehash of Doom stealing the Power Cosmic from the Silver Surfer back in the 60’s.

It was mindless trash.

Stephane Savoie

July 30, 2009 at 4:53 am

Gavin: go back and reread that scene. While it’s true that they don’t explain the symbiote’s history, it’s clear that Spidey used a different machine than the other heroes. He’s pointed to a room full of super-tech, and guesses which one is the costume-maker.
He guesses poorly.

Stephane Savoie

July 30, 2009 at 4:55 am

BTW, I thought SW was great when it came out. Then again, I was 10 years old – I guess that’s the market Shooter was writing for back then.

Not to revive the Great Jim Shooter Controversy, but he was a much better manager than editor, and a much much better editor than writer.

Unfortunately, he loved to write. And since he was in charge, nobody could really tell him he wasn’t that good.

To make the whole thing more frustrating confusing, Shooter’s writing was damnably uneven. He was typically mediocre, and often quite bad… but occasionally he’d write something good, and once in a great while he’d surprise the world and produce something that was — by the standards of the time — almost excellent. His first year or two on Avengers was solid, and included one of the great multi-issue fight scenes (Avengers vs. Nefaria) of the 1970s.

All that said, this is kinda cheesy. The final panel is okay, but IMO it’s a stretch to call it “cool”.

Doug M.

It isn’t totally true that he uses the wrong machine…it is just him going which one of these makes costumes?

How many machines in there are going to make costumes? And why wouldn’t they show him the exact machine they used?

It was lazy writing back then and it is still lazy writing now when I look back on it.

The Crazed Spruce

July 30, 2009 at 5:04 am

When my older brother got married, his comic book collection wound up mixed in with mine. They all wound up either destroyed by my mother or crammed in a box and hidden under the stairs some time in the mid-80s, but a few managed to escape and found their way back into my posession a few years later. One of the comics that survived was a coveless copy of Secret Wars #12. And if you think that splash page has an impact….

And I don’t get all this hate for Secret Wars, either. Okay, maybe I get it, but I don’t agree with it. Was it high art? Hell, no. Was it meant to be? Hell, no! It was what it was, a classic Marvel-style “heroes-meet-then-fight-amongst-themselves-then-kick-bad-guy-ass”, only on a much grander scale. And most of all, at least for me, it was damn entertaining!

(And yes, for me, the moment is definitely Thor’s hammer smashing through the wall. Then again, when isn’t that cool?)

Thor’s hammer coming out of nowhere is ALWAYS a cool shot.

It was poorly written and badly drawn…..look at those panels and tell me that is good work.

Look at the fourth page when doom says “Absurd! That couldn’t happen! The odds are impossible!” and tell me with a straight face that panel alone isn’t downright horrible.

The whole thing was crap.

Bernard the Poet

July 30, 2009 at 5:39 am

I think the reason I hated Secret Wars so venomiously back then, was that I loved the original idea so much. An army of Marvel superheroes versus an army of Marvel supervillains, how could you get that wrong? I spent the summer of that year writing and drawing my own version of Secret Wars (I was about twelve) and although I haven’t re-read since, I’m pretty confident it was much, much better.

By-the-by Brian, is there any truth to the story that Jim Shooter chose to write Secret Wars because Marvel had just brought in bonuses for top selling series and he knew that mega-crossover maxi-series would clean up?

I was eight when I read this, and when I was eight I loved it. I loved Spider-Man defeating Titiana by making her fall hundreds of feet. I loved the Hulk holding up a freakin’ mountain on his back and Reed belittling his intellect (Hulk had Banner’s mind at the time) to make him angry so he could keep the mountain up. I loved Hawkeye shooting an arrow through one of the Wrecking Crew’s invulnerable skin at close range, after he warned him! I loved Magneto being placed with the heroes at first, then becoming like a third faction altogether. I loved Galactus trying to devour Battleplanet so he can challenge the Beyonder and finally be free of his curse to eat planets. I loved the heroes coming back to life at the end. And that image of Cap’s indestructible shield laying in ruin is iconic to me.

And some good things came out of Secret Wars. The black costume. The view of Magneto not as a black and white villian but more as a ruthlessly militant civil rights warrior. She-Hulk as a member of the FF. Hulk reverting to a mindless beast and being banished to the crossroads of reality or whatever by Doctor Strange. Thing exploring an entire planet as Ben Grimm almost like a barbarian warrior. As a kid I enjoyed all those storylines. (Although Johnny getting with Alicia was a terrible idea).

I guess if this came out now, as an adult I would probably hate it. But when they came out as a kid, Secret Wars was awesome!

I remember reading them with my dad and loving him doing all the different voices for each character. And I remember how excited I was when my dad got me the Secret Wars adventure for the old Marvel Comics RPG (I must have played it twenty times over, usually alone because it was hard to find enough kids with the attention span needed for such an epic campaign).

But Secret Wars II was always an abomination, even when I was nine years old. (Always dug the image of an entire building made of gold though)


July 30, 2009 at 6:22 am

Just to clarify, Hulk and Thor are leaving the tech room (’cause Hulk needed new, torn up pants, apparently) and all they say is “Yeah, there’s a costume machine in there. Use it. We’ve got to go show off our new threads to some chicks.”

Spidey doesn’t know which machine it is, and to tell the truth, it’s rather blatent. They later confirm it was the wrong machine. That’s not poor storytelling, really. Some might find it lame, but it’s a basic bait and switch. There’s plenty wrong with this crossover, but for me, it’s just plain fun. In the same way watching Godzilla’s Revenge is fun…

I have no problem with Secret Wars. I got the first issue when I was six. At that age, I was only familiar with Spider-Man and the Hulk from their respective cartoon shows, and had NO idea who these other heroes and villains were. To me, that was me taking my first step into the larger Marvel Universe, and it was damned cool.

Also looking back, Secret Wars did then was “52” did only a few years ago with the “missing time” concept: one month, the heroes disappeared; the next month, they came back with dramatic changes, and the series raised the question of what the heck happened to them. Spidey gets a new costume? She-Hulk is in the FF, and the Thing is missing? And…I’m not sure it affected the other series that much (the Hulk returned with a crutch, and he lost it the next issue).

Secret Wars II, an abomination? Yeah, probably. I’m grateful to the Beyonder for getting the Hulk back to Earth, but that’s about it. However, even SWII had some cool moments. I LOVED the story where Spidey had to rescue people from a collapsed building which they Beyonder turned to gold. I also dug the story where the Thing had to save the Beyonder from a horde of villains, including the Juggernaut, by himself.

Hell, I’m making the request right now. Brian, can we get Web of Spider-Man (I think it was #6) as a cool moment? Specifically, the scene with the notebook. It’s such a great Spidey moment.

Just to point out: Legends was way better than SW. Actually, I reread it and it sounds a much better reading than anything big crossover Marvel came with afterwards. It gave us Suicide Squad AND JLI. That’s enough for making it worth.

The Crazed Spruce

July 30, 2009 at 7:20 am

Legends was okay, but I don’t know if I’d call it better than Secret Wars. Better than Secret Wars II, sure…. (Hell, Genesis was better than SW2!) Legends did have some good moments, though. (Personaly, I liked what happened when G. Gordon Godfrey tried on Dr. Fate’s helmet. But hey, that’s just me….)

I also thought this was awesomewhen I was 8. It’s still pretty cool, actually. Secret Wars II was certainly terrible, but it led to some cool moments in the crossover issues themselves. Those X-Men issues where Rachel fights the Beyonder are pretty solid. It’s pretty hard to believe that the Spidey gold notebook dilemma lasted as long as it did. It was kind of dumb, but it ressonated at the time.

I like the bit where Doom just keeps killing and reviving Captain America.

SW I and II have their moments. Thor’s hammer is a nice touch, but I think the scene at the end of the comic with Cap’s shield is even better.

Sure, it’s cheesy as anything, but hey…comics, right?

the moment from the series is seeing klaws mind games driving doom so nuts he almost brings klaws theory to life and goes into ta rage. that plus doom panic when he see’s thors hammer crashing through makes secret wars good or bad a classic.not tomention see what dooms face looks like without the mask

wow, lots of hatred for a fun book. I mean people go to see the Fast and Furious movies (enough to make multiple sequels) but enjoying this is somehow bad? Secret Wars was one of the last fun books in comics, it was full of cool sequences, had a little bit of everything, nearly every character gets a moment. And I don’t know what is wrong with the art, we have guys like deodota that people think is great, and then people say this is bad? seriously?

I mean Spidey stomping the x-men, hulk holding a mountain, ton of great Captain America moments, even the villains have great moments, Magneto befriending(and maybe more) the Wasp, Doom being Doom. This was exactly what a 12 issue mini-series should be, if it’s designed to sell toys and introduce new fans to the characters.

Also not getting the hate.

I was a kid when I collected this and loved every issue. Read it not too long ago and it is still holds up. Why? Because I understand that its a superhero comic book for kids. A simple concept, peppered with cool moments (Spidey swatting Wolverine like a bitch was my personal favorite) and most of it drawn by a great artist. And even with as simple a concept as it had, there were some cool concepts in there like the discussion the heroes had about letting Galactus eat the planet, sacrificing themselves so that the universe would be rid of his threat. Also the idea that a human mind, even one of the most disciplined and intelligent minds in the MU, is not capable of handling true omnipotence.

Another great thing about it was it was a major crossover event entirely self contained in 12 issues. I didn’t have to buy every goddamn comic marvel pumped out to understand what was going on. Which was especially important since at that age most of my spending money came from coins I’d find hidden in the couch cushions.

@ Capt USA- It is entirely possible (even likely) that the commenters who think Secret Wars was stupid also think Fast and Furious is stupid as well. I didn’t notice anybody praising Deodato in the thread either.

I liked Secret Wars. I was a kid, but it was fun. All the biggest stars, all the biggest baddies, new spider man look, Johnny Storm and Colossus going after the same alien girl, the X-Men trying to beat up on Spidey and vintage Victor Von Doom ego. The obnly thing I had against it was I wasn’t a big fan of Molecule Man. Oh well.

After a re-read, I thought that when the girls go back to their apartment while flying back to Earth is pretty funny too.

Wow.. I can’t believe so many people dislike Secret Wars. I thought it was a great read when I was 10, and I still like it today. I mean, it’s clearly written from a different era. What with stuff actually happening, and entire issues not filled with dialogue, the way the BendisVerse is today.. But yeah, I stand by Secret Wars as a Good Product from Marvel.

And if it was a response to DC’s Crisis, I say score one for Marvel. I picked up the Crisis trade after hearing how awesome it was.. and was pretty disappointed. I mean the art is far better, thanks to George Perez, but the story is just a muddled mess, and an excuse to shake up the status quo. Say what you will about Secret Wars, but at least you could follow the story.

I loved this series as a kid, and re-read it in college and still loved it. I haven’t read it in quite a long time, now, but I’m willing to bet I’d still findit a lot of fun. It’s not high art, but it was a good super-hero story, and most of the time that’s all I’m looking for in a super-hero comic book.

And I think Fast and the Furious is stupid, too. Make of that what you will.

Secret Wars was never good. Not at the time, not today. But at least we got some cool action figures out of that mess.

Even if you use the argument that Secret Wars was just a fun team-up maxi-series, the comic wasn’t very good at that. Some good moments, but I found that most of the characters were either left in the background or written in a caircatured fashion.

What bothered me most was how Shooter wrote Rhodey’s IM as the stereotypical black guy, using crude grammar and basketball metaphors, doing little but being the muscle, and crudely attempting to put the moves on Monica Rambeau ( apparently because she was the only other woman of color in the non-mutant hero camp ). Portrayals of Rhodey in the Iron Man comic at the time were much more complex, and I wish Shooter had chosen to work with the character’s vain quest to preserve Iron Man’s legacy in light of Tony Stark’s downward spiral, instead of just going with ” black guy “.

I liked Secret Wars! Haven’t read it in a long time, but I think I’d still find it fun.

It had it’s problems, I wasn’t a fan of the X-men getting kicked around for the first half of the series, and Torch quoting Culture Club is pretty…actually that’s pretty funny, looking back. Cheese, but of the enjoyable, pepperoni pizza kind!

I expected the moment to be either the Black Costume or Wolvie chopping off Absorbing Man’s arm, but this is a great choice too.

I loved Secret Wars.

It was a perfect maxi series for the time and has been poorly emulated later. We had a whole year to find out how all the big changes that had happened to our returned heroes came to be.

You didn’t have to buy a single outside issue to understand what was going on yet it caused changes to every other major Marvel title out there. From this series we got the Black Costume, Hulk with a broken leg, She-Hulk on the FF, Colossus finally broken up with Kitty Pryde, Magneto as a multi-layered character, and Ben Grimm Space Ranger!

C’mon. It was awesome and you all know it. Last year I got Jim Shooter to sign my SW #8 and it’s my favorite autograph on a comic yet.

Well, for not being all that interesting a concept, I must say it had some extremely cool moments.

Hulk holding up mountain – check.

Wolverine slicing off Absorbing Man’s arm, and his freakout over whether it would reattach when he resulmed his human form – check (I had forgotten about that one, dhole!).

Galactus not playing the game, and standing around calling his ship, so that he could kick the Beyonder’s ass and release him from “the hunger” – check (never has a character not doing been so critical. Galactus is such a force of nature that no one could ignore him, and it underscored that he was not a “villain” in the traditional sense.)

Best of all, Doom trying to steal the Beyonder’s power and failing, and managing through shear force of will while being vivesected by Beyonder to still make his plan work – check, please!

And I believe it started the storyline of Magneto joining with the X-Men rather than automatically fighting them.

Yep. Doom taking going over the boss’ head and taking it to the top is one of the greatest Doom moments ever. And the cover to Secret Wars 10? One of my favorite comic book covers ever.

I’ve said my bits n’ pieces about SW in other threads on this site- loved it, own it, and this was the gateway comic for me to start collecting comics (just like the kid in Millar’s 1985)- well, this and Captain America 298.

Point is, it was a fun series full of great moments, the inconsistencies in the art were annoying (yet Milgrom probably managed his best work – the cover to SW 4 despite that) but when Zeck nailed it he nailed the crap out of it (again, SW 10), it kept to itself, didn’t demand you buy 50 issues of some other book, had some consequences lasting to this day, and showed that when Spidey uses his head and doesn’t whine, he can humiliate the X-men.

I enjoyed SW (and for that matter, SWII). It’s not high art, but it brings the awesome: Doom and Galactus are outstandingly portrayed.

Did anyone know that there was a Marvel Comics based game called Mugen? Its a free game and features Spiderman, X-men, The Avengers and more. There is like Spidermna, Venom, Carnage, Armored Spiderman, Symbiote Spiderman and too many more to mention. You can ploay as the good guys or the bad guys. Anyhow, I thought this would be a relevant post and get some more people into playing Mugen since you can create your own Marvel characters or modify the existing ones.

In the UK reprints that shot of the hammer coming through the wall was the end of the issue… Fantastic cliffhanger!

Love Secret Wars. It has proper gonzo comic book stuff of the type that gets frowned on these days because it’s not realistic….

I never much cared for Secret Wars; I didn’t hate it, but it certainly seemed to meander quite a bit. It may have been better served by being shorter.

This scene, for example, is incredibly annoying, while trying to be clever.

I never got to read the entire series (and Marvel made it ridiculously high-priced to get the trade, $48 canadian? Really?), but I loved the action figure series to bits. They were awesome, and made of that cool bendy plastic that was near impossible to break. The arms and legs were easy to put back on, not like the equally cheap-ass, but less resilient, Super Powers toys.

I managed to get ahold of the Secret Wars Iron Man toy at a ‘Con many years ago, and still hold onto it this date. Stealthwise, you’re right that the toys have an impressive resilience ( even if they’re far simpler than contemporary toys ).

If there’s one thing I’m grateful for Secret Wars, it’s for introducing a comprehensive line of Marvel action figures, and I’m glad that Hasbro’s releasing new Secret Wars themed figures. :)

The tpb was among my first comics. I loved it the first time I read it, and I still enjoy it upon rereading, although the flaws really start to show quickly. I can kind of understand the strong distaste for it, but it certainly has some cool moments, and its worst moments are easy enough to forget.

Not a big Secret Wars fan myself, for a number of reasons;

1) It seemed that every character who wasn’t a mutant had just joined the Reverend Stryker brigade, and even fellow heroes were treating the X-Men like they had a collective case of B-O. Yo, guys, the X-Men saved the world almost as often as the Avengers, cut them some slack, huh?

2) Everyone shouted. A disproportionate number of sentences ended in exclamation points. No subtlety.

3) I know that Shooter had mandated Claremont to break up Colossus and Kitty, but Dolly Parton in Space was a little heavy-handed. Not to mention unnecessary; Doug Ramsey had already unknowingly driven a wedge between them by then. Admittedly the actual X-Men issue where Peter gave Kitty the “we can still be friends” speech was well-handled.

4) Spider-Man’s new costume. Looked cool, but giving him a costume that had its own powerset seemed a bit off.

5) All the main plotlines were given away by the time Issue #3 was released. We all knew who would come back and what their status would be.

As of Joss Whedon’s run on AXM, every plotline introduced by Secret Wars was reversed. That makes me happy.

Ah, but Kirayoshi, I thought it was pretty cool that it took that long for the Peter/Kitty romance to be resolved- come on, that’s 20+ years (let’s say… 5… in comic book years) for Peter and Kitty to deal with Peter’s infidelity (and of course… his death). And let’s face it, Joss didn’t exactly let ‘em have too long after that…

I despise Spidey’s black costume for unleashing tons of really awful Venom/Carnage stories on us, but I loved the costume design (and actually found it far more interesting when it was just the costume running around stalking Peter).

I’d also take a moment to remember that before yeeeears of retconning (in both the comics and television), all the symbiote really did was mimic clothing and let Peter shoot webs from the tops of his hands (which, physically seemed a much more awkward setup as he’d have a harder time grabbing the end of the line that way). All that “extra strength” and “mind control” jazz never happened to Peter in the comics. The costume would take his sleeping body out for joy rides now and then, but it didn’t make him stronger or alter his personality. And though he kept the design (Black Cat thought it was sexy and made him like 500 cloth outfits), he didn’t wear the symbiote for very long.

Shooter writes TERRIBLE “crazy.” All Klaw needs is to add the word “quack” to every sentence.

American Hawkman

July 31, 2009 at 6:26 pm

In fairness, Klaw’s craziness here isn’t Klaw being crazy… it’s the Beyonder’s consciousness inhabiting Klaw deliberately messing with Dr. Doom’s head.

The Wasp’s casual murder in issue six of the series was a real shocking moment for me, mostly because it came out of nowhere and was so brutally efficient and clear-cut that I was genuinely puzzled as to how they could reverse it.

Worth noting that the repairs made to the Iron Man armor in this series also became sentient and went on a rampage… about 6 years later, in Quasar. Rhodey dumped them as soon as he got home, because they started malfunctioning, and it took them that long to drag themselves back into contact with superhumans. :)

Nitz – Are you sure we were reading the same Iron Man at the time? Rhodey was developed well under Dave and Bob, for sure, but O’Neil was still putting the same sort of dialogue in his mouth that even the KKK would have considered a little too over the top, and doing so in 70s jive so stereotypical that you’d think he was taking lessons from Luke Cage if Cage had a severe head injury. (And, to remind everyone, this was in the mid-80s. Mr. T sounded more dignified about half the time.) Shooter, if anything, was writing Rhodey EXACTLY the same as O’Neil did. It’s amazing to me in retrospect that I look back on that run making Rhodey my favorite character at Marvel, considering how genuinely horrific the dialogue was.

No surprise here, I’m with everyone who feels that the words “Secret Wars” and “cool” don’t belong in the same sentence.

As far as the whole “it’s great if you were 10 when it came out” argument goes, well, sure, that’s true enough, but I’d still gladly put anything I bought* in my 10th year (1974) up against this, even with the coldest of hindsight.

*Note what I did there, if you’re of a mind to sweep the archives for the crappiest stuff to come out that year as an argument.

I liked this issue of SW. There were many others that were terrible. I was about twelve or thirteen when these came out and even then, I knew they were crap. But in hindsight, I can’t find it in myself to hate it.

Klaw was f%cking annoying. There WERE cool moments, like the aforementioned Hulk-holding-up-a-mountain scene but Shooter wrote his own characters who just happened to have the same names as Cap, Spidey, Wolverine, etc. Rhodey was terrible. The Wasp and Magneto? WTF? The Healer Chick? Didn’t she bang Johnny Storm, too? I love it when aliens have the same sex-parts as humans. That makes PERFECT sense, doesn’t it?

Secret Wars Too (Electric Boogaloo) – Have you LOOKED at this lately? WACKY. And I mean , Wacky-in-a-way-popular-entertainment-is-no-longer-allowed-to-be. Jesus. The Beyonder’s outfit? His hair? Why does God have a jeri-curl, Mommy?

But some of the tie-ins are actually not bad. David Mazzuchelli on Daredevil? When the Beyonder offers Matt his sight back? That’s a cool moment. (Indeed, I believe it was, many days back.)

I enjoyed Secret Wars then and now. I don’t believe it’s anywhere as bad as some believe.

It was pretty clear to me that Spider-Man used the wrong machine(it wasn’t a costume machine Gavin).

The art was no where as bad as 90’s Marvel, please, I mean really.

The writing was no where as bad as 90’s Marvel, please, I mean really.

The writing was no where as bad as deconstruction period that Marvel is going though. I’ll take 10 Secret Wars over one Secret Invasion. Hell, I’ll even take two Secret Wars 2 over Secret Invasion.

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