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You Decide ’11 – New Batman versus New Captain America!

Each day this month, I’ll be posting a different poll question – each poll will last five days, and I’ll reveal the results of the finished polls every Tuesday.

This way, for this month, we can see what our readers feel about various comic book questions. For a month, you folks will decide! Click here to see the other questions that you can answer as well as checking out the latest poll results!

Read on for the latest poll question!

In honor of commenter Jack Norris, here is another “who would win in a fight” question!


58 Comments

Where’s the option for none?

I have to abstain from voting.

Sorry, posted too soon, thought it was about whom of the two you prefer.

Bucky only because of his bionic parts.

Bucky hasn’t done anything because he’s been dead, so the advantage goes to the original Robin.

I like both characters, but let’s be real:

Bucky has a robot arm and uses guns.
Dick Grayson was trained by Batman.

The Man Wonder wins in under five minutes.

Bucky was trained by Captain America and trained with the Black Widow. Realistically it probably would be a draw, but Bucky’s bionic arm might decide it.

What about Superman vs. the Silver Surfer? The Hulk vs. the Flash? Green Lantern vs. Iron Man? Why aren’t we deciding these important questions?!

I think Batman could beat just about anyone really if given some time to prepare.

Captain Bucky, with a gun and with less compunctions than Steve and the Batmen about messing up another white hat.

Presuming Dick lets Bucky even see him…

Batman’s whole thing, traditionally, is not fighting until he has an upper-hand. The same should go for Dick, who should have at minimum equivalent training, but more varied experience.

If we were talking Bruce Wayne Batman, the fight would be over in a second, probably, since Bruce usually wins his fights before they even get started … With Dick Grayson Batman, maybe that would last longer … I don’t know Cap enough to really answer, but the Batman fan in me says Dick anyway !

The question doesn’t presume that Dick “Batman but really Robin” Grayson has time to prepare. In match-ups of this sort, you should assume both parties are thrown into an arena and forced to fight spontaneously.

Just look at the batting averages of the two characters.

Dick Grayson all the way.

If Bucky the master assassin known as the Winter Soldier had time to prepare, he could get the drop on anyone this side of Thor. So you can’t assume one side is prepared and the other isn’t.

What about Superman vs. the Silver Surfer?

Superman

The Hulk vs. the Flash?

The Hulk is blatantly too slow to hurt The Flash, but too tough to be hurt by him. Draw.

Green Lantern vs. Iron Man?

Green Lantern – blatantly

Poison soup at a Wayne enterprises charity gala.

“Poison soup at a Wayne enterprises charity gala.”

Yeah, CapBucky’s kind of a bastard and BatRobin really isn’t. I vote Bucky here.

The question is “How much prep time?”

bucky is a cold blooded killer, or can be if needed. i really enjoy dick-bat, but he’s way too much of a nice guy.

Decided to go with Dick, just ’cause that’s a whole lot of experience as Robin, plus a whole lot of experience as Nightwing, and now Batman.

I know technically Bucky’s been gathering just as much experience over the last few decades, but we readers didn’t get to see that as it developed, so it doesn’t count! (what, we have to take Brubaker’s word for it?)

I always like to go with Batman’s wallet over street-level guys, which kind of is what Bucky’s Cap has been. The equipment Batman has at his disposal really gives him a chance over any regular guy-syle superhero. Has anybody here read Byrne’s Batman/Captain America story? Wayne and Rogers were described as equals there, even accounting for the super-soldier serum. I imagine their proteges would be the same in a hand-to-hand scenario, with Bucky’s arm advantage nullified by Dick’s utility belt. But yeah, bring in a bat-vehicle into this equation and down goes Cap.

Bucky would win. He was trained to be a assassin and do the dirty jobs during the war while Steve couldn’t. They’re both orphans, but Bucky was raised in an army base. Plus he was the Winter Soldier. Dick’s a second rate Batman. Oh and Bucky can handle the shield as well.

Bucky will become overwhelmed as he asks ” Where did he get ALL those toys?”
Dick Grayson has had a lifetime of experience and started his career at a younger age than Barnes.
He has dealt with Cosmic threats. He has never been retconned and always been who we knew.
Bucky became something else and after being kicked in the ass by Grayson, can become. a ‘Face’ or ‘Heal’, depending on the writing.. Barnes could be like a wrestler who can become a Hero or Villian in a turn of the page.
Grayson will never change, just grow and improve.

Haven’t followed either character recently, but I still can’t help but feel that Bucky is no Steve Rogers, while Dick is *almost* Bruce Wayne, so…

Bucky wins.

The man is a soldier and a killer. Dick is a detective and an acrobat.

Plus, thanks to the writers, Dick rarely has been out of the shadow of Batman. He’s the sensitive guy that is always losing fights and only manages to beat second-rate villains. Jusk ask T.

Bucky is a bit of nutcase and will never be the leader that Steve Rogers is, but at least he can kick ass with the best of them.

On the sidelines, you have Bruce and Steve eating peanuts and watching their proteges beat the crap on out of each other, while critiquing their performance.

DickBat comes across as NEARLY as accomplished as BruceBat.

BuckyCap comes across as NOWHERE NEAR as accomplished as SteveCap.

This isn’t even close.

Yeah, I almost feed bad about consistently betting against Bucky, because I do enjoy Brubaker’s Cap run, but Dick just has his act much more together.

Yeah, this is tight but, when it comes down to it Bucky’s a good fighter with a robot arm, a gun, and a cool shield. If Dick can hold his own against Deathstroke, he can take Bucky.

And I’d love to see a panel in this fight (make it happen Marvel and DC!) where Dick hits Bucky’s robo-arm with those taser knuckle things he’s been using and makes it go all explodey.

Putting on a Batman costume does not make you Bruce Wayne. The ‘Batman always wins’ arguments are null and void here. Bucky Barnes ftw.

Okay, if you were to ask me who SHOULD win, I agree it should be Dick in theory. Being trained by Batman from childhood plus on the job experience from the time he was a kid and it should be no contest.

But come ON people. Look at the actual in-story track record. How many wins has Dick Grayson had against a first tier martial artist? And saying he can hold his own against Deathstroke is charitable interpretation at best, every book I’ve seen Deathstroke trounces him effortlessly. I haven’t read many Dick as Batman stories, so I don’t know if in the past year they’ve improved his track record against top-tier fighters. I do know Tomasi had a story where he beat R’as Al Ghul in a fight, breaking his 3 decade losing streak, but I’m sure in the short time he’s been back Bucky has already surpassed Dick Grayson’s amount of wins against top tier fighters.

I agree that the Batman fanboyism is blinding people.

If the question were Golden Age Robin or Silver Age Robin versus Bucky I’d definitely choose Dick Grayson then.

Dick. Trained from a younger age than Bucky, and trained by Batman (sure Cap is a good fighter, but it’s Batman). Dick has gone up against much bigger threats than Bucky, and he can beat pretty much everyone except the top-tier fighters(Bruce, Lady Shiva etc.) and if he has the utility belt he’s can even hold his own against some of them (though not for too long).

But really it all comes down to prep time. And not in the way everyone else is saying. Dick is a master improviser. Anyone saying Dick would win with time to prepare is wrong. Dick doesn’t prepare, at least not nearly as much as Bruce. So by the rule of no prep time (as these should be) Dick should win, since I can’t imagine Bucky could do as good as Dick with zero preparation

It’s probably too late and I don’t know if we’re allowed to request polls. But it would be nice to see one for favorite Spider-man villain. I want to see if everyone in fact votes for Doc Ock over the Green Goblin (I’d put them all together but it would be interesting split, too) since they always say he’s the better villain (or was until the late 80’s).

Dick. Trained from a younger age than Bucky, and trained by Batman (sure Cap is a good fighter, but it’s Batman). Dick has gone up against much bigger threats than Bucky, and he can beat pretty much everyone except the top-tier fighters(Bruce, Lady Shiva etc.) and if he has the utility belt he’s can even hold his own against some of them (though not for too long).

Please, can someone tell me one of these great fighters Dick has held his own against? The only respectable top-tier fighter I’ve seen him beat is R’as Al Ghul. I’m being serious here, I’ve never seen it except for that one issue by Peter Tomasi. Has it been happening in the recent issues where he’s Batman?

I’m really curious because nothing I’ve read in his post-Silver Age track record shows he can dominate against top tier fighters. Maybe I’m wrong here because I am just missing the books where he does well.

I go with BuckyCap over DickBatman; their fighting skills are about equal, but Bucky’s bionic arm coupled with his greater ruthlessness give him the edge.

Since this idea is so ripe why not a month of bracket style superhero battles? works for March Madness and provides for the year of a month of theme… Make it Happen Brian!

@dnwilliams

No, but being trained by Batman for almost your entire life and getting approval from him to be Batman kinda does.

Really tough one, but I think I’m going to give it to Dick.

Ed (A Different One)

February 25, 2011 at 1:24 pm

OK – next we’re going to have to see a face off between Rick Jones and Jason Todd – battle of the second-generation sort of side kicks who either got beaten to death by a super villian or drifted off into some other comic to be someone else’s sidekick, etc., etc., etc.

Of course, Rick Jones is A-Bomb now, so maybe that wouldn’t be too compelling after all . . .

Man people love their Bats, no matter who’s behind the cowl. T makes a great argument, and nobody seems to be able to retort. Nonetheless, I say Cap takes the title. Have a good weekend all!

Look, I know it’s troll-y and kind of dickish to complain about free web content, but really, the drop-off between interesting discussions about creators, their contributions to great characters and series, etc., and “who would win in a fight” arguments (the single lowest discussion comics fans can engage in) is pretty drastic.

Okay. now I get the “In honor of Jack Norris” part of Brian’s post.

Jack, you do realize that by complaining about this again you may end up getting another such post? Unless that’s secretly your plan using reverse psychology…

T., I’ve only read the Morrison issues, and Dick Grayson only fights new villains – guys like Mr. Pyg and the Flamingo, that are cool and extra-creepy, but not exactly heavy hitters in the DCU. He fought one “old” villain, Jason Todd, another former Robin.

No, you don’t see Dick Grayson kicking butt against established characters in the Morrison stories either. He is depicted as an awesome detective, and a guy so nice and cool that even ultra-bratty-ubermensch-wannabe-Mary-Sue Damian Wayne is won over by Dick’s charisma.

But I never get the sense that he is a badass in combat. He SHOULD be, but for some reason he is almost never depicted as one.

T: somehow I missed that reference to my bitching in the post.
Oh, well. I could see how the “you get the opposite of what you want when you complain” thing could happen, and I apologize if that’s what happens.
It’s just that… come on: it’s a “who would win in a fight” argument. People cite them when making derisive jokes about comics fans, fer chrissakes.

Addendum:
Joe Rice must be rolling in his grave.

Dick Grayson, no contest.

Well, speaking of the “who would win” arguments, there’s a neat little story in Anything Goes #1 with art by Beto and written by, I think, Jan Strand, that’s a little vignette about how “who would win” has played a role in his real life…

But Dick vs Bucky? Hmm. I like how someone said that Dick doesn’t really plan, so he’d probably do better with no prep. But I agree with T about how Dick’s been depicted. That 2 parter that Denny O’Neil wrote that was a prelude to Battle For The Cowl had Dick get his ass kicked by some lameasses, and he had to be rescued (from a fire, I think?) by a PIZZA DELIVERY GUY! Sure, he was off because he was mourning Bruce’s “death”, but STILL! Then the more recent Cornell 3 parter in B&R had Dick being way more unsure of himself than he should be. He’s been a superhero most of his friggin’ life!

What’s funny is that I have a bunch of Batman and Captain America trades out from the library and will be (re)reading the more recent runs of these characters.

But yeah, preferring Batman, I’d go with Dick. If only cuz Damian would probably pull some weird shit to help Dick win.

I don’t hate such questions like Jack Norris, but I get endlessly frustrated by them. It’s very hard to separate “who would win” from “who is your favorite.” Some do it unconsciously, but Travis Pelkie even admited that Dick Grayson is always having his ass kicked, but he’ll vote him anyway, because he likes Batman! At least you’re honest, pal. Got to give you that.

Without getting too “Rumbles” here, if it’s a fight to the finish, Bucky takes it, because he’s vicious enough and well-trained enough to kill someone. Dick wouldn’t go there.

I went Bucky. Dick works best as part of a team, either with Bruce or the Titans or Tim or Damian. I don’t think anyone who goes by the name “the Winter Soldier” takes very well to relying on backup.

Decided to go with Dick, just ’cause that’s a whole lot of experience as Robin, plus a whole lot of experience as Nightwing, and now Batman.

Yes, Dick has a lot more experience, but most of that experience is losing and having self-doubt and inferiority complexes.

I know technically Bucky’s been gathering just as much experience over the last few decades, but we readers didn’t get to see that as it developed, so it doesn’t count! (what, we have to take Brubaker’s word for it?)

We don’t have to just take Brubaker’s word for it. We can just go by the little bit of Bucky’s experience that we have seen since his return. He beat Batroc and Crossbones. That’s two top tier fighters he won against. In two years of on-panel experience he already doubled Dick Grayson’s 30 year track record, where he only won 1 fight against a top tier fighter, R’as Al Ghul. Why bother worrying about Bucky’s off-panel experience when what little on-panel experience he has already gives him a superior record?

I did vote DickBats cuz even though Dick IS getting his ass kicked all the time (as T’s pointed out elsewhere, THANKS Marv Wolfman!), he SHOULD be more awesome. And I’m sure Bruce has taught him some dirty tricks over the years.

Granted, I had to drop some books awhile back, and I kept on with Morrison’s Batman and dropped Bru’s Cap.

But who would win between Grant Morrison and Ed Brubaker? They’ve both been in fights, from things they’ve said. Bru apparently grew up on army bases (why would he be attracted to the Bucky character? :) ), but Morrison’s probably worn a kilt and been beaten up for it. But I’d give the edge to Bru just cuz he’s actually had published comics that he’s written AND drawn (at least, more recently than GM, I believe).

Is Crossbones really “top tier”?

Is Crossbones really “top tier”?

If he can give Captain America a run for his money in hand to hand combat, yes. He’s considered one of the best hand to hand combatants of the Marvel Universe. When I say top-tier, I mean in terms of fighting skills.

I voted Bucky Cap, no question.

Bucky was an assassin in WW2 and served alongside the Invaders, then became the Winter Soldier and became an invisible assassin. You only saw him if he wanted you to. He has gone toe to toe with some of caps best villains and if i remember right, Wolverine.

People on here have cited prep time, but between being a soldier and an assassin, Im guessing his ability to think almost reflexively as well as painfully well thought out would both be through the roof.

Batmans cool and all, but the difference is:

Dick: Kid Sidekick, Acrobat, Detective, Caped Crusader
Bucky: Kid Sidekick, Soldier, Trained Assassin, Acrobat, Bionic Superhero

A few toys will not be enough to close the gap here. Neither will a cool costume.

I said Dick. Why? Because even as Robin the kid could hold his own in a fight. And that is what this is. A fight. This isn’t (I’m assuming since both are heroes) a fight to the death. This is a regular superhero showdown which means no death.

Which puts Bucky at a disadvantage. Because his experience as a hero is more limited than Robin. Being a soldier means you know how to kill. Not fight. Granted this is a close match. As close as a Cap vs. Batman fight. But where-as Cap is a Supersoldier AND a top tier fighter (thus should have the edge against bats) Bucky is NOT a supersoldier. Just a badass assassin turn hero.

If this was a fight to the death or if both had time to prepare (which we usually throw out) bucky would win. Because that is what he did for so long. Kill metas.

But in a fight? I say Dick.

Which puts Bucky at a disadvantage. Because his experience as a hero is more limited than Robin.

Dick Grayson has more fight experience. Unfortunately 99% of that fight experience is LOSING the fights. It’s not just who has more experience, it’s who has experience WINNING. Dick may have more fight experience as a hero, but Bucky already has more experience actually WINNING fights as a hero.

It’s not just experience, it’s successful experience that matters. If the contest was “Who would be more likely to bounce back after losing a fight” THEN I’d vote Dick because his experience compared to Bucky’s in that department is untouchable.

all who have undergone training by the BATMAN are youngsters and have reach the peak almost as the BATMAN especially those who have become Robins, thus making them more advantage in skills, tactics and excellent fighters. which means no matter how advantage their opponent be in physical enhancement they are outwitted easily.

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